Boxing - great upcoming fights

[Luv2Phuket]

I'm not a fan of Turki -- this is just one big ego play, using (wasting!) Saudi money to make himself a big shot.

One of the guys he has "shunned" is Tim Tszyu.  I asked a friend "in the know" what Tszyu did wrong.  Turki reached out to him, and Tszyu said "talk to my management -- they make the deals; I just show up and fight." 

Apparently, that offended Turki who insists on speaking to the fighters directly.

They are losing tens of millions of dollars on these shows, and reducing the PPV to $20 is just going to increase the losses.

Much like the LIV Tour in golf, there's a reason underlying this that is best NOT discussed on PA under Rule 2(f).

At some point, I think the Saudis will going to get tired of flushing money down a toilet.

[Harry Brown]

2 hours ago, Luv2Phuket said:

I'm not a fan of Turki -- this is just one big ego play, using (wasting!) Saudi money to make himself a big shot.

One of the guys he has "shunned" is Tim Tszyu.  I asked a friend "in the know" what Tszyu did wrong.  Turki reached out to him, and Tszyu said "talk to my management -- they make the deals; I just show up and fight." 

Apparently, that offended Turki who insists on speaking to the fighters directly.

They are losing tens of millions of dollars on these shows, and reducing the PPV to $20 is just going to increase the losses.

Much like the LIV Tour in golf, there's a reason underlying this that is best NOT discussed on PA under Rule 2(f).

At some point, I think the Saudis will going to get tired of flushing money down a toilet.

There should be a formula to follow like  No 1 has to fight no 2 and 2 fight three and so on. if they reject the fight then the belt gets taken away and the next guy moves up a place.

[D-low]

17 hours ago, Harry Brown said:

There should be a formula to follow like  No 1 has to fight no 2 and 2 fight three and so on. if they reject the fight then the belt gets taken away and the next guy moves up a place.

There will be. Saudi want to model boxing on the UFC model. One division, one belt, one champion. All the main promoters are falling in line, no one cares about existing sanctioning bodies and boxers evenutally will have no choice. Middle aged people like me that grew up with boxing are sick of fights not being made, young people won't put up with things like my generation. in UFC you get amazing fights all the time in a structured way. Boxing admittedly has picked up in the last few years but it's not where it needs to be.

Boxing isn't like golf or F1, it can be bought and organised. Politics aside Saudi are giving us what we fans want. It's not great for the fighters though as they lose the power (although it's  payday bonanza atm). UFC fighters are bascially employees begging for a first chance and after that have to fight when told for what money they are told. Awful from a human perspective, great from a fight perspective.

[Luv2Phuket]

The problem with the "Saudis will form a league" concept is WHO will develop young talent -- the prospects that are developed by the big promoters?  Promoters lose money on these guys as they are coming up, but hope to eventually get their money back.  Take away that future incentive, and who is going to want to put up the investment?

Also, promoters are cooperating for now, because they get a good chunk of the money the fighters are making.  But make no mistake, the fighters are under contract and will continue to be.

I'm surprised the Saudis haven't approached the 4 sanctioning bodies and just bought a few of them out.  With the millions they are dropping, they should be able to pull it off relatively inexpensively.  Hell, buy 2 and freeze the other 2 out.

[Harry Brown]

3 hours ago, D-low said:

There will be. Saudi want to model boxing on the UFC model. One division, one belt, one champion. All the main promoters are falling in line, no one cares about existing sanctioning bodies and boxers evenutally will have no choice. Middle aged people like me that grew up with boxing are sick of fights not being made, young people won't put up with things like my generation. in UFC you get amazing fights all the time in a structured way. Boxing admittedly has picked up in the last few years but it's not where it needs to be.

Boxing isn't like golf or F1, it can be bought and organised. Politics aside Saudi are giving us what we fans want. It's not great for the fighters though as they lose the power (although it's  payday bonanza atm). UFC fighters are bascially employees begging for a first chance and after that have to fight when told for what money they are told. Awful from a human perspective, great from a fight perspective.

 

Well the Saudis have done that with golf "LIV"

and in regards to the UFC there is the "ONE" championships and K1 and a few others.

I think there will always be offshoots.

 

[Harry Brown]

1 hour ago, Luv2Phuket said:

The problem with the "Saudis will form a league" concept is WHO will develop young talent -- the prospects that are developed by the big promoters?  Promoters lose money on these guys as they are coming up, but hope to eventually get their money back.  Take away that future incentive, and who is going to want to put up the investment?

Also, promoters are cooperating for now, because they get a good chunk of the money the fighters are making.  But make no mistake, the fighters are under contract and will continue to be.

I'm surprised the Saudis haven't approached the 4 sanctioning bodies and just bought a few of them out.  With the millions they are dropping, they should be able to pull it off relatively inexpensively.  Hell, buy 2 and freeze the other 2 out.

 

Obviously you know a hell lot more than me on this subject.

I think the different belts or governing bodies, when they were created is when it starts to go wrong, I'm not sure of what it is like now but there were some dubious decisions occasionally, along with some undesirables getting involved. 

I wonder, were the different governing bodies created to avoid that? Or maybe those sorts created them to wrest control/money, I'm not sure.

I would have thought it would be better to have just one governing body and have one person at the top of each division.

I think there will always be the four governing bodies and the Saudis will make it five.

I heard that Tim Tsyu told them to talk with his manager about money etc as he just does the fighting and they got shitty with that and have trie to shut him out, same with Canello they seem dirty on him, although Im not privy to the coins on so may be misinformed. 

I agree with D-Low that fights seem to stall for ages, they should be made to fight or take their belt off them.

[D-low]

5 hours ago, Harry Brown said:

 

Well the Saudis have done that with golf "LIV"

and in regards to the UFC there is the "ONE" championships and K1 and a few others.

I think there will always be offshoots.

 

LIV split golf, some came, some didn't, the Majors didn't change. ONE is MMA, kickboxing and Muay Thai, it's huge in Asia but non-existant in the West, as is K1. Those are different organistations within the sport and are completely separate. UFC effectively is MMA in the West; Bellator was constantly on the verge of collapsing as no-one watches it, PFL bought it but it's not doing much better. The Saudis could buy PFL for instance but that's not buying a sport.

Boxing isn't split, there's no different global organisations with fighter rosters, just a few promoters. There's not really that many fighters either. The way boxing is structured both with fights and the money, get a few big names and everyone will follow. You won't have an off-shoot as there's nothing to off-shoot, you'll just have Saudi calling the shots.

Currently everyone in boxing is chasing the Saudi money. They're all holding out hoping Turki will pick them to be on one of these Riyadh season cards as even undercard guys make huge money. Turki can buy boxing wholesale and have no competition, something that hasn't been possible with other sports. 

[bgtp]

11 hours ago, Harry Brown said:

I heard that Tim Tsyu told them to talk with his manager about money etc as he just does the fighting and they got shitty with that and have trie to shut him out, same with Canello they seem dirty on him, although Im not privy to the coins on so may be misinformed. .

Turki along with the WBA have come up with a new website called fightfax.com they want to be the new source of all fight data, an alternative to boxrec if you will. I noticed they have Tszyu ranked much lower than he should be lol. Boxrec rankings have plenty of issues, but they do use an objective mathematical formula to generate them, so at least there are no personal biases. Ring’s rankings are usually pretty good, but they are owned by Golden Boy, so there’s that. Of course, any rankings are subjective and should be taken with a grain of salt. Speaking of Tszyu, I just saw he’s fighting next month against Murtazaliev and it’s taking place in my city. Guess I’m going.

6 hours ago, D-low said:

… just a few promoters. There's not really that many fighters either.

Sorry, this is just plain wrong.

Edited September 9, 2024 by bgtp

[Luv2Phuket]

2 hours ago, bgtp said:

Turki along with the WBA have come up with a new website called fightfax.com they want to be the new source of all fight data, an alternative to boxrec if you will. I noticed they have Tszyu ranked much lower than he should be lol. Boxrec rankings have plenty of issues, but they do use an objective mathematical formula to generate them, so at least there are no personal biases. Ring’s rankings are usually pretty good, but they are owned by Golden Boy, so there’s that. Of course, any rankings are subjective and should be taken with a grain of salt. Speaking of Tszyu, I just saw he’s fighting next month against Murtazaliev and it’s taking place in my city. Guess I’m going.

 

Very interesting -- I need to look into this.

Fightfax is not new; it used to be the official recordkeeper of boxing.  All commissions in the USA required a "FightFax report" before they would let a guy fight.  They used to publish a book that was thousands of pages long and listed every fighter.

BUT they became Blockbuster Video.  The owner (a very good friend of mine who passed away a few years ago) refused to update his technology, and, eventually, BoxRec passed them up.

My guess is that, after his death, the domain name became available and they purchased it.

BTW, I don't say a lot of negative things about the sanctioning bodies (because I have worked with 2 of the 4 and know most of the people very well), but the WBA is the very definition of corruption. 

[D-low]

2 hours ago, bgtp said:

Sorry, this is just plain wrong.

I don't mean in the entire sport, I mean fighters that matter. Go to Boxing Scene for instance, they break down each sanctioning body's top 15 at all weights. Be honest and ask yourself firstly how many you've heard of outside the top 10s (combined even). Then, how many really matter. I'm a hardcore fan, I've been watching boxing for 40 years and travelling the world to watch fights since after university. I have no idea who half of those fighters are.

Turki just needs to get the main guys on board, everyone else follows. It's happening as we speak. We've just had a 'Riyadh season' event in LA with Crawford Madrimov, we've got another one in Wembley this month with AJ v Dubois. Bivol Beterbiev up next in Saudi, a fight we have wanted for years. All down the card these guys are on the Saudi tit. Turki wants Canelo involved, that's how he's moving. This is just a matter of time as we are seeing Saudi take over in real time.

As Hearn points out, Saudi still needs Matchroom, Queensbury etc for the infrastructure, grassroots, smaller halls, mid halls etc. Which I go to btw. But the entire sport will dance to Saudi's drum.

As for these 'new rankings', sure they can't be trusted. It's like UFC have rankings. Are they the absolute best in the world? No, there's Dagastani wrestlers that would kill half the division, but it's the best we care about. Over time boxers that don't want to play ball in Saudi will have to join lesser promotions that spring up and fight for small money against other 'nobodies'. But then you'll have a PFL or BKFC ie: promotions no-one cares about. The money will be too much so I doubt people will do that and it takes a high enough number of them in each division to do that. This is prize fighting after all, it's all about who puts up the cash. 

Edited September 9, 2024 by D-low

[bgtp]

5 hours ago, D-low said:

I don't mean in the entire sport, I mean fighters that matter.

You didn’t say you were only talking about certain fighters/promoters, so I assumed you were talking about the entire sport which is how I was viewing it. I love a big fight as much as the next guy, but also don’t mind watching people I’m not familiar with, up and coming prospects, etc. I go to a lot of smaller cards at home too, in addition to sometimes traveling for big fights. I’d love to check out a small hall card in the UK (and Japan) someday. I’ll also sometimes watch smaller promotions online like ProBox. On one of my trips last year, I went to 4 fight cards in 3 days in Bangkok (2 boxing and 2 Muay Thai). Regarding the boxing, I only knew of one fighter beforehand (Srisaket), but I learned about a Thai prospect who I then saw fight again on another visit. That prospect was Chainoi Worawut who recently fought Sam Goodman in Australia. I don’t bother with the sanctioning bodies rankings, but if look at the Ring’s ranking for example, I do recognize most of the top 10 listed in each division.

Even though I’m very much a casual when it’s comes to MMA, I still realize there’s more to it than UFC and enjoy watching other promotions. My friends who are hardcore MMA fans follow other promotions as well. Regarding Turki, his money and boxing, time will tell. I did find this video on the new FightFax here if anyone’s interested. I haven’t watched it yet myself as it’s over an hour in length.

 

 

Edited September 9, 2024 by bgtp

[CBNewbie]

The Saudis have been great for boxing. I’m not sure how much we will need promoters in the years to come, it could become quite interesting. 

[D-low]

13 hours ago, bgtp said:

You didn’t say you were only talking about certain fighters/promoters, so I assumed you were talking about the entire sport which is how I was viewing it. I love a big fight as much as the next guy, but also don’t mind watching people I’m not familiar with, up and coming prospects, etc. I go to a lot of smaller cards at home too, in addition to sometimes traveling for big fights. I’d love to check out a small hall card in the UK (and Japan) someday. I’ll also sometimes watch smaller promotions online like ProBox. On one of my trips last year, I went to 4 fight cards in 3 days in Bangkok (2 boxing and 2 Muay Thai). Regarding the boxing, I only knew of one fighter beforehand (Srisaket), but I learned about a Thai prospect who I then saw fight again on another visit. That prospect was Chainoi Worawut who recently fought Sam Goodman in Australia. I don’t bother with the sanctioning bodies rankings, but if look at the Ring’s ranking for example, I do recognize most of the top 10 listed in each division.

Even though I’m very much a casual when it’s comes to MMA, I still realize there’s more to it than UFC and enjoy watching other promotions. My friends who are hardcore MMA fans follow other promotions as well. Regarding Turki, his money and boxing, time will tell. I did find this video on the new FightFax here if anyone’s interested. I haven’t watched it yet myself as it’s over an hour in length.

 

 

Thanks for the video link, I'll watch that later. If you do go to the UK I'd assume you'd be in London, York Hall in Bethnal Green (East London) is a great place to watch up and coming boxers, even the odd 'name'. Joshua after winning the Olympics (which I was lucky enough to be at) fought there in his second or third fight (which I was also lucky enough to be at!). It's so rowdy and doesn't hold very many, you're very close.

I plan on Japan too, I want to see Inoue. If there was a catchweight fight with Nakatani I would skip a Thailand trip for that! Looks like he may be heading to Vegas next year though. I'm torn about that. I've done Vegas so much and America is my least favourite place to go. Madison Square Garden is a phenomenal venue and so is MGM but NY has other things, Vegas, I've done the clubbing/pool party thing to death.

I always try to get to fights in BKK but have to say I usually stick to Lumpinee or Rajadamnern. I've done Channel 7 (I think it's called that, something like that anyway) which was smaller and Siam Boxing Centre, but I'd like to see more small hall when I'm there.

 

Edited September 10, 2024 by D-low

[bgtp]

Knockout is going to the desert. Should be a good fight. Collazo is a little terror. I’ll be in Thailand at the time and assuming/hoping it’s on Thai TV.  Might be in the wee hours though with the time difference.

OSCAR COLLAZO-THAMMANOON NIYOMTRONG RING STRAWWEIGHT CHAMPIONSHIP SET, NOV. 16 IN RIYADH

[bgtp]

On 28/09/2024 at 00:42, bgtp said:

Knockout is going to the desert. Should be a good fight. Collazo is a little terror. I’ll be in Thailand at the time and assuming/hoping it’s on Thai TV.  Might be in the wee hours though with the time difference.

Well, Knockout got stopped in the 7th round and Thailand no longer has any world title holders. Collazo looked sharp and will be a fighter to follow as he moves up.

A couple of Thais have title shots before the end of the year, so maybe they’ll get one back. A couple of boxing cards taking place when I’m Bangkok at the end of the month. I’ll try to catch at least one as long as I’m not tied up with other activities.

[Coldunatae]

On 17/11/2024 at 03:29, bgtp said:

Well, Knockout got stopped in the 7th round and Thailand no longer has any world title holders. Collazo looked sharp and will be a fighter to follow as he moves up.

A couple of Thais have title shots before the end of the year, so maybe they’ll get one back. A couple of boxing cards taking place when I’m Bangkok at the end of the month. I’ll try to catch at least one as long as I’m not tied up with other activities.

Tough break for Knockout, but Collazo’s performance was impressive! Hopefully, Thailand regains a title soon—those upcoming fights sound promising. Enjoy the boxing cards in Bangkok; live matches always have an unmatched energy! 🥊

[Gaztop08]

The rematch is coming.Usyk v Fury.This trailer from Sky Sports more like a movie.They have certainly spent some money on this one.

 

 

[InDaClub]

21 minutes ago, Gaztop08 said:

The rematch is coming.Usyk v Fury.This trailer from Sky Sports more like a movie.They have certainly spent some money on this one.

Great trailer, also I'm a sucker for Usyk. Can't wait for the rematch.
Also, I like the Saudis recently hosting so many events in boxing/ufc, a much more enjoyable timezone to me than the US 😂

Edited December 3, 2024 by InDaClub

[bgtp]

Not exactly ‘big’ fights, but I’m looking forward this week’s Navarrete vs Valdez 2, Espinoza vs Ramirez 2 card. Both first fights were bangers. Last weekend of my current trip and I’ll try to watch at The Sportsman in Bangkok.

[bongbong99]

On 03/12/2024 at 19:42, Gaztop08 said:

The rematch is coming.Usyk v Fury.This trailer from Sky Sports more like a movie.They have certainly spent some money on this one.

 

 

Bloody hell the left side of the thumb nail looks like Tyson is giving birth to usyk hahah.

Wonder if loma will fight again next year. One of my faves

[Luv2Phuket]

So....who you got in the rematch this weekend?

I'm curious to see if Fury can make adjustments after what I felt as a pretty convincing win for Usyk the first time.

Given what an asshat Fury's dad is, I would love to see Usyk in a repeat.  That said, unlike their first fight, John Fury has been relatively quiet in the lead up to this one.

[neo1011]

4 minutes ago, Luv2Phuket said:

So....who you got in the rematch this weekend?

I'm curious to see if Fury can make adjustments after what I felt as a pretty convincing win for Usyk the first time.

Given what an asshat Fury's dad is, I would love to see Usyk in a repeat.  That said, unlike their first fight, John Fury has been relatively quiet in the lead up to this one.

I just put a bet on fury to win in the first 6 rounds, I think if he hasn’t won in the first 6 then Usyk will win

[bgtp]

10 minutes ago, Luv2Phuket said:

So....who you got in the rematch this weekend?

Usyk

[Herbby]

I hope Usyk wins. Fury is an absolute wanker.

[Luv2Phuket]

Just saw that Fury is 20 lbs heavier than first fight and now outweighs Usyk by 55 lbs.

I predict he tries to use the Klitschko technique, where he will hold and lean on top of Usyk to wear him out.

Could make for a very ugly fight that is hard to score.

Looks like it lines up with college football here, so I'll be watching that instead.