Retirement Visa

[Daveo]

Had many friends use this guy, Darren from UK, knows his stuff

[davidge]

1 hour ago, ChiFlyer said:

That is my understanding as well. I enter Thailand in late September. My original O-A has a "valid thru" date of October 25th 2018. I am collecting all the materials to "extend" it and plan to do so shortly after my arrival in Jomtien in late September.

My understanding of the O-A extension process is that you can do it when you are within 30 days of the "valid thru" date. One is advised to begin the extension process more than 15 days before the valid thru date, or there could be complications that are best avoided. And yes, this has to be done from within Thailand.

In my case being retired and looking to spend about 8 months a year in Thailand, having to be there in late September every year is not a bad thing.

Here is a link from the Pattaya Ex-Pat Community board that has a lot or really excellent information on all this. These guys are long term ex-pats with a lot of experience in these things.

http://www.pattayacityexpatsclub.com/expats/docs/retirementvisachecklist.pdf

I know that posting links to other boards is a no-no here, but in this case I think it is warranted.

Sorry, I think you’re still not getting the point I tried to make. The link is fine, but largely aimed at those who have moved to Thailand permanently - which is the intention of the visa after all. The advice doesn’t really deal with those who are using the O-A to come and go.

Your visa expires on 25 October BUT when you enter in late September they will stamp your passport with Permission to Stay until late September 2019. 

The visa cannot be extended. People do not stay in Thailand on this visa, they stay on Permissions to Stay. It is the Permission to Stay that needs to be extended. A visa only gives you permission to enter Thailand.

Your Permission to Stay will expire in September 2019. That is when you need to get your first Extension of Stay. An Extension to Stay extends your Permission to Stay. It does NOT extend a visa.

One very important proviso, as your visa expires on 25 October you then do not have permission to enter Thailand again on this visa BUT if you get a Multiple re-entry permit after your visa expires then you keep your Permission to Stay valid until September 2019. So, you can leave and re-enter as you want up to this time.

 

In summary, you do not need to do the TM7 etc this trip. Before you leave at the end of the trip, go to Immigration and get a multiple re-entry permit. That’s it.

September 2019, make sure you’re in Thailand as you will need the TM7 etc then.

[ChiFlyer]

18 hours ago, davidge said:

Sorry, I think you’re still not getting the point I tried to make. The link is fine, but largely aimed at those who have moved to Thailand permanently - which is the intention of the visa after all. The advice doesn’t really deal with those who are using the O-A to come and go.

......

One very important proviso, as your visa expires on 25 October you then do not have permission to enter Thailand again on this visa BUT if you get a Multiple re-entry permit after your visa expires then you keep your Permission to Stay valid until September 2019. So, you can leave and re-enter as you want up to this time.

In summary, you do not need to do the TM7 etc this trip. Before you leave at the end of the trip, go to Immigration and get a multiple re-entry permit. That’s it.

......

Ok. Thanks for taking the time to go through all of this.

I have been gearing up for some unrequired overkill it appears. At this time I have the TM.7 package pretty much prepared. Since I would have to go to Immigration anyway for the multiple entry update, I will probably just execute the TM.7 instead, agreeing that it is not really necessary given the multiple entry update route.

[davidge]

You’re still missing the point, but I’m done now.

[davidge]

Ok, halfway through my second large coffee so, with the aid of caffeine:

You cannot do an Extension of Stay as you will already have Permission to Stay until September 2019.

What you need to do this trip:

1. Make sure your landlord submits a TM30 when you arrive;

2. Go to Immigration and complete a TM47 to report your new address;

3. Remember to do your 90-day report in December (unless you’re leaving before then);

4. Before you leave, get a re-entry permit. Multiple if you’ll be going and coming back more than once before September 2019.

 

 

[ChiFlyer]

18 hours ago, davidge said:

Ok, halfway through my second large coffee so, with the aid of caffeine:

You cannot do an Extension of Stay as you will already have Permission to Stay until September 2019.

What you need to do this trip:

1. Make sure your landlord submits a TM30 when you arrive;

2. Go to Immigration and complete a TM47 to report your new address;

3. Remember to do your 90-day report in December (unless you’re leaving before then);

4. Before you leave, get a re-entry permit. Multiple if you’ll be going and coming back more than once before September 2019.

 

 

On my first glass of wine.

Once again, thanks for your advice.

Sorry if I am rambling on a bit about this, but I find it a little confusing.

I am renting through Dancewatchers. They are very good about TM30 and also producing a rental contract agreement for proof of residency upon request. That type of efficiency is one reason I continue to stay with them despite their being a little more expensive. Also, we have some mutual friends.

I will be staying through March 2019 and am making initial plans to return in May 2019 for two months as well as return again in September 2019 for 6 months or more. I have been looking at this from a perspective of establishing near full time residency in Jomtien.

I guess I have not been understanding and am still questioning the underlying O-A Visa and how it functions. 

It makes me uncomfortable that my O-A Visa is only good through October 25, 2018. I want to avoid going through the initial process of establishing one a second time. The initial process is considerably more onerous than the TM.47 process IMO. I also question if the TM.47 is used for multiple purposes. Additionally, the rumor mill has it that Thailand is looking at more restrictive rules for the initial process, given the current number of ex-pats in the country.

I've got a good friend (not on this board) who has been living the ex-pat life in Jomtien for 17 years. I will run the details by him for comment, although I suspect he will say it's been a long time since he went through the initial processes. He will add in that things can and do change and it all depends on who you end up standing in front of at Immigration.

Again, thanks for the interest. If I come up with anything additional that I consider to be relevant, I will post it to this thread.

If nothing else, this thread has probably saved me $50 USD and the inconvenience of a US Embassy Income Statement visit as that seems completely useless given that I have had more than 800,000 baht in a Thai bank account, since mid-June.

TiT indeed -

I owe you a beer or something, when we are in town at the same time.

 

[dave01]

My experience:

 

Entered on single entry tourist visa. That gave me 60 days... I could have extended another 30 days, but chose not to. Towards the end of the 60 days, I converted to a non imm visa, which gave me another 90 days, at the same time I was granted a retirement extension for 12 months.

So, when you convert to a non imm type visa and apply for the retirement extension, you are given a total of 15 months, before you have to renew your retirement extension (permission to stay).

I never understand blokes who go the non imm way in their home country. By doing it here, there are less hoops to jump through, and is pretty simple.

The most common confusion blokes fall for, is that they confuse the validity of their visa with the permission to stay stamp.  To be clear, the visa is the tool that allows you entry to the country. Once you enter it's job is done...  The permission to stay stamp is the one that matters. It allows you to stay in the country up to the end date of the stamp NOT THE VISA.

[ChiFlyer]

2 minutes ago, dave01 said:

My experience:

.......

I never understand blokes who go the non imm way in their home country. By doing it here, there are less hoops to jump through, and is pretty simple.

The most common confusion blokes fall for, is that they confuse the validity of their visa with the permission to stay stamp.  To be clear, the visa is the tool that allows you entry to the country. Once you enter it's job is done...  The permission to stay stamp is the one that matters. It allows you to stay in the country up to the end date of the stamp NOT THE VISA.

Thanks. Your Visa comment is both appreciated and also very much like the one that Davidge gave earlier in this thread.

I take the opposite view on doing it from the home country. I can mail in the forms with a prepaid return envelope and never visit in person a Thai Consulate or spend time in Thailand at Immigration. There is a little more leg work on supporting materials required, but not all that much.

Again, I am looking at this from a perspective of spending most of the next 10 years with Jomtien as my home base. I just want to be careful that I am not making future inconveniences for myself that could be avoided.

 

[Oukiva]

15 minutes ago, dave01 said:

I never understand blokes who go the non imm way in their home country. By doing it here, there are less hoops to jump through, and is pretty simple.

The 800k baht is a problem for some people. Some of them don't have the money. Others don't want to bring "so much" money in Thailand. Don't forget that not all embassies are as easy as the USA's one to get a revenues attestation...

[Billyboy294]

16 minutes ago, dave01 said:

My experience:

 

Entered on single entry tourist visa. That gave me 60 days... I could have extended another 30 days, but chose not to. Towards the end of the 60 days, I converted to a non imm visa, which gave me another 90 days, at the same time I was granted a retirement extension for 12 months.

So, when you convert to a non imm type visa and apply for the retirement extension, you are given a total of 15 months, before you have to renew your retirement extension (permission to stay).

I never understand blokes who go the non imm way in their home country. By doing it here, there are less hoops to jump through, and is pretty simple.

The most common confusion blokes fall for, is that they confuse the validity of their visa with the permission to stay stamp.  To be clear, the visa is the tool that allows you entry to the country. Once you enter it's job is done...  The permission to stay stamp is the one that matters. It allows you to stay in the country up to the end date of the stamp NOT THE VISA.

Did you go to Bankok to convert to a Nom Imm O and how much?

[Billyboy294]

I prepared this for two friends, one of whom has now got the RV

Easiest Route to get a RV,

 

 

1.   Get a 3 months Non- Immigrant O visa in your own country. London Embassy £50 . (Or can get at Bangkok Immigration)

2.   Open a bank account and transfer over 800,000 baht. Some branches will do, some wont. You might need a letter from Immigration to the bank to say OK as you plan to get a RV.

3.   Wait until you have the 800,000 in the bank for 2 months.

4.   Go to Immigration and apply for Extension of Stay usually referred to as a Retirement Visa (RV). See next section.

Complete Form TM7 –“Application for Extension of Temporary Stay in the Kingdom”. (ask for 365 days)

Fee 1900 Baht.

Take Passport and copy of relevant pages of the Passport.

Copy of bank book. 

Letter from bank confirming you have over 800.000 within 3 days of going to immigration. Take some money out of the bank a few days earlier to prove the 800,000 Baht is in an accessible account.

Copy of rental agreement (or equivalent) confirming your residence.

Make sure when arriving in country that your place of residence has been registered with immigration .Form TM30 can be used,

 

Note: As an alternative to 800,000 Baht in a bank account you can use Letter from your Embassy confirming you have a pension/ income equivalent to 65,000 Baht per month. In which case I don’t think you have to wait 2 months before applying for the RV.

The Non-Immigrant O Visa can be obtained at Bangkok Immigration. Jomtien Immigration’ can get it for you from Bangkok but I have heard “fees” of 20,000 baht mentioned but I assume they process the RV at the same time..

If application is approved you will have to go back next day to collect your passport with the RV stamp. Make sure you have already have a set of photo-copies of your passport pages and get a copy of the RV stamp and apply for a re-entry Visa on Form TM8. Single entry 1000 baht; Multiple entry 3800 Baht.

Get the Form when you go to apply for your RV and complete before you go back.

Unless of course you plan to stay in Pattaya for the next 12 months.

[Billyboy294]

A friend went to Jomtien to Register his TM30 form. He told them at the section on the left which deals with the TM30 that he was intending to get a RV. They said they can get it for  him. Cost 33,000 baht.

[ChiFlyer]

47 minutes ago, Billyboy294 said:

A friend went to Jomtien to Register his TM30 form. He told them at the section on the left which deals with the TM30 that he was intending to get a RV. They said they can get it for  him. Cost 33,000 baht.

Not a good deal to say the least. :(

 

[JAI DEE MAK]

On 8/19/2018 at 11:28, Daveo said:

Had many friends use this guy, Darren from UK, knows his stuff

+ 1 Top guy IMO.

JDM

[davidge]

3 hours ago, ChiFlyer said:

On my first glass of wine.

Once again, thanks for your advice.

Sorry if I am rambling on a bit about this, but I find it a little confusing.

I am renting through Dancewatchers. They are very good about TM30 and also producing a rental contract agreement for proof of residency upon request. That type of efficiency is one reason I continue to stay with them despite their being a little more expensive. Also, we have some mutual friends.

I will be staying through March 2019 and am making initial plans to return in May 2019 for two months as well as return again in September 2019 for 6 months or more. I have been looking at this from a perspective of establishing near full time residency in Jomtien.

I guess I have not been understanding and am still questioning the underlying O-A Visa and how it functions. 

It makes me uncomfortable that my O-A Visa is only good through October 25, 2018. I want to avoid going through the initial process of establishing one a second time. The initial process is considerably more onerous than the TM.47 process IMO. I also question if the TM.47 is used for multiple purposes. Additionally, the rumor mill has it that Thailand is looking at more restrictive rules for the initial process, given the current number of ex-pats in the country.

I've got a good friend (not on this board) who has been living the ex-pat life in Jomtien for 17 years. I will run the details by him for comment, although I suspect he will say it's been a long time since he went through the initial processes. He will add in that things can and do change and it all depends on who you end up standing in front of at Immigration.

Again, thanks for the interest. If I come up with anything additional that I consider to be relevant, I will post it to this thread.

If nothing else, this thread has probably saved me $50 USD and the inconvenience of a US Embassy Income Statement visit as that seems completely useless given that I have had more than 800,000 baht in a Thai bank account, since mid-June.

TiT indeed -

I owe you a beer or something, when we are in town at the same time.

 

I thought it was probably the visa part that you were ‘obsessing’ about.

As dave says, the visa is completely irrelevant to your long term status. It’s just the starting point. There’s often confusion as a lot of people talk about having a ‘Retirement Visa’ or needing to ‘renew their visa’. Neither are true. From this trip on, you are able to live in Thailand as you have ‘Permission to Stay’. As long as you keep this valid then you will never need another visa. 

 

2 hours ago, dave01 said:

My experience:

 

Entered on single entry tourist visa. That gave me 60 days... I could have extended another 30 days, but chose not to. Towards the end of the 60 days, I converted to a non imm visa, which gave me another 90 days, at the same time I was granted a retirement extension for 12 months.

So, when you convert to a non imm type visa and apply for the retirement extension, you are given a total of 15 months, before you have to renew your retirement extension (permission to stay).

I never understand blokes who go the non imm way in their home country. By doing it here, there are less hoops to jump through, and is pretty simple.

The most common confusion blokes fall for, is that they confuse the validity of their visa with the permission to stay stamp.  To be clear, the visa is the tool that allows you entry to the country. Once you enter it's job is done...  The permission to stay stamp is the one that matters. It allows you to stay in the country up to the end date of the stamp NOT THE VISA.

 

[ChiFlyer]

21 hours ago, davidge said:

I thought it was probably the visa part that you were ‘obsessing’ about.

As dave says, the visa is completely irrelevant to your long term status. It’s just the starting point. There’s often confusion as a lot of people talk about having a ‘Retirement Visa’ or needing to ‘renew their visa’. Neither are true. From this trip on, you are able to live in Thailand as you have ‘Permission to Stay’. As long as you keep this valid then you will never need another visa. 

 

 

Agreed.

What is commonly referred to as a "Retirement Visa" is actually an "O-A Long Stay Non-Immigrant Visa". There is an actual "Retirement Visa" as well, but as I recall that is good for 10 years and requires 8 M Thai Baht in a Thai Bank. A little out of my range, besides the 90 day reporting is still required.

http://www.richardbarrow.com/2016/12/long-stay-thai-visa-for-senior-tourists-to-be-extended-to-10-years/

Lots of good info in this thread.

 

 

[usexpat46]

On ‎8‎/‎21‎/‎2018 at 13:55, davidge said:

 

From this trip on, you are able to live in Thailand as you have ‘Permission to Stay’. As long as you keep this valid then you will never need another visa. 

 

 

Also this visa needs to be transferred to your new passport when the old one expires.  I've had to do this twice,  My embassy gave me a letter to give to Thai Immigration, no cost incurred.

[Ludhamlad]

16 minutes ago, usexpat46 said:

Also this visa needs to be transferred to your new passport when the old one expires.  I've had to do this twice,  My embassy gave me a letter to give to Thai Immigration, no cost incurred.

Did you get the new passports in Thailand or back in the US?

[usexpat46]

Just now, Ludhamlad said:

Did you get the new passports in Thailand or back in the US?

Both at the US Embassy in Bangkok.

[ChiFlyer]

Since we got into the topic of Re-entry permits in this thread, I looked up the topic and found a useful page. If you need to go this route, there is some good info here and it is worth a read.

http://www.pattayacityexpatsclub.com/expats/docs/Rentry_Address.pdf

 

 

[udontony]

On 8/21/2018 at 11:33, Billyboy294 said:

I

 

 

 

Letter from bank confirming you have over 800.000 within 3 days of going to immigration. Take some money out of the bank a few days earlier to prove the 800,000 Baht is in an accessible account.

 

 

 

Immigration in Udon Thani insist that the letter from the bank is done on day of application, also you have to withdraw or add money to the account on that day.   Not all immigration are the same.

[Billyboy294]

It sometimes depends on what officer you get and often how busy they are. If very busy at Jomtien and a big line of people waiting , they are not so fussy for a day or two .

[Billyboy294]

2 hours ago, udontony said:

Immigration in Udon Thani insist that the letter from the bank is done on day of application, also you have to withdraw or add money to the account on that day.   Not all immigration are the same.

All Jomtien ask (sometimes) is that the  bank balance statement (including the in/out)  is updated to the day you go. The in or out can be earlier

[usexpat46]

7 minutes ago, Billyboy294 said:

All Jomtien ask (sometimes) is that the  bank balance statement (including the in/out)  is updated to the day you go. The in or out can be earlier

For the past 10 years on my renewals at Jomtien I've shown them my Fixed Deposit passbook with Bangkok Bank without any problems.

[Billyboy294]

23 minutes ago, usexpat46 said:

For the past 10 years on my renewals at Jomtien I've shown them my Fixed Deposit passbook with Bangkok Bank without any problems.

 

35 minutes ago, Billyboy294 said:

All Jomtien ask (sometimes) is that the  bank balance statement (including the in/out)  is updated to the day you go. The in or out can be earlier

My comment above was based on  my experience when i went with a friend to help him get his first RV on 7th August 2018. His bank statement was updated to 4th Aug when he took out some money but that was not good enough, they wanted bank statement up to 7th Aug.