Long Haul Business Class for under $2K (Long Post)

[Luv2Phuket]

After the 2 calls I just had with US Air, I doubt that I will be buying any more US Air miles.

 

I use BA's Avios system to search for oneworld availability -- it shows first class availability one day that I was looking at (160k RT) and business class (multiple seats) another day (the dates are almost a year out -- next February).  In the past, I have always been able to use AA to book whatever Avios shows as available, which makes sense -- the limited seats that Cathay makes available are available to all oneworld members.

 

NOT according to US Air's phone reps -- they claim that US Air only gets allotted a certain number and that, even though Cathay has available seats through oneworld, they are NOT available using Dividend Miles.  I have never heard anything like this, so I tried again and got the same song and dance.   

 

Maybe that IS their policy, but I can't help but doubt it.  

 

Very disappointing, especially since US Air's website is absolute shit when it comes to finding flights -- Bangkok isn't an option, even if you choose the "US Air and partners" option.

 

It looks like my US Air "war chest" might sit until I can transfer/convert them to AA miles, where I have had MUCH better luck in booking trips (basically, if Avios shows it available, AA has always allowed me to book it).

Edited April 8, 2014 by footypjman

[wackyjacky]

 US is buying AA not the reverse. Maybe you can sneak one last one in. Hard to believe that America West is one of the biggest airlines in the world now. ps:  So much for the 90K to HKG. Check this shit out:  http://boardingarea.com/onemileatatime/2014/04/08/american-and-us-airways-award-program-changes-without-notice/

Edited April 8, 2014 by wackyjacky

[fatjack1]

So what is this devaluation of which you guys speak?  Damn this is almost a full time job keeping track of airline miles and such.

 

Because of this thread I got the Chase Sapphire Preferred card a while back with the bonus and all.  I have since accrued 157,988 points.  I also have some miles with EVA from flying.  

 

SHould I transfer these points into my EVA account and get a RT Royal Class ticket ASAP or what?  And yes, I admit I don't "get it" cause I can't stay focused long enough so I do appreciate the help from those of you who actually  understand this system.  

[Little Evil]

So what is this devaluation of which you guys speak?  Damn this is almost a full time job keeping track of airline miles and such.

 

Because of this thread I got the Chase Sapphire Preferred card a while back with the bonus and all.  I have since accrued 157,988 points.  I also have some miles with EVA from flying.  

 

SHould I transfer these points into my EVA account and get a RT Royal Class ticket ASAP or what?  And yes, I admit I don't "get it" cause I can't stay focused long enough so I do appreciate the help from those of you who actually  understand this system.  

 

I could be wrong, but I think the devaluation is still in speculation mode, but people are assuming it will be in the 140-160k range for RT business for what was once 90-120k.

 

 

While I'm not particularly happy about devaluations, I am more concerned about US Airways buy miles bonuses going away. That was the whole reason this thread started, as to point out that one could flat out buy the majority of a RT business class trip for under $2k via miles, when buying the same itinerary with cash would be $4-8k depending on airline.  At the time, RT economy was already $1600-1900, so that was an absolute steal. I love the credit card churning game, but sometimes I just feel lazy and have no issue buying miles for a trip. Hell, it was only a couple hundred more than economy. That is what I fear we might loose. Still, even at the higher miles rates, a 160k trip with miles valued at current bonus rates ($.0175) would be $2,800 (less with share miles). Not great, but still far cheaper than actually buying the tickets with cash. Now factor in a credit card sign-up bonus a year, some surveys, a few purchases through the shopping portal, and restaurant awards, you can probably cut that down to 100k miles to buy ($1,750 miles purchase). Game got harder indeed.  

 

 

Your 158k is more than enough to currently fly EVA Royal Laurel RT to BKK from just about anywhere.  I personally would book now if you have your dates. There's no harm in booking now unless you're unsure of travel dates. Just a word of caution for EVA: Be careful with EVA regarding Royal and Premium Laurel. Got 4 legs Royal Laurel last Nov, but for my next trip I wasn't paying attention to the itineraries that were being forwarded to me and booked a trip where the regional flights (TPE to BKK) are Premium Laurel (think:older Thai business class with 170* seats).  I think the Royal Laurel are the 77W's, where the Premium operate with A320's (might need fact checking on that one).  

 

[wackyjacky]

Check out your airline partners with Ultimate Rewards. There will be no Eva (which is a good thing). Their program still sucks I assume. You've got UA, BA, KA and who the fuck knows. Best option from the States is probably still fucking United. You'll have to stay on UA metal or you'll get miles- fucked. So fly to NRT (or wherever) in Biz on UA, then in Econ to BKK shorthaul on Thai, Ana, or SQ. There are no UA connecting flights to BKK anymore, so even if you just fly 1 leg short haul on a partner airline in Biz, you'll get miles-fucked. If you drop down to Econ, you won't..

Edited April 8, 2014 by wackyjacky

[Little Evil]

Check out your airline partners with Ultimate Rewards. There will be no Eva (which is a good thing). Their program still sucks I assume. You've got UA, BA, KA and who the fuck knows. Best option from the States is probably still fucking United. You'll have to stay on UA metal or you'll get miles- fucked. So fly to NRT (or wherever) in Biz on UA, then in Econ to BKK shorthaul on Thai, Ana, or SQ. There are no UA connecting flights to BKK anymore, so even if you just fly 1 leg short haul on a partner airline in Biz, you'll get miles-fucked. If you drop down to Econ, you won't..

 

Good point. No direct path to get onto EVA via Chase Sapphire Preferred airlines. UA is still Star Alliance, but I have to take back that 120k I mentioned earlier. It would be 160k to book through UA, right? Last time I took UA on award I flew UA business longhaul to Korea, then Thai business from there to BKK. UA has pretty decent IFE. Seats aren't so bad either, but the arrangement is something less than desirable. Still have to do the "step over" or be stepped over when lounging or in bed mode. Avoid the center on wide bodies, as they still pack em in 4 deep in the center row. I'd hate to have to settle for one of the two center seats in that configuration. Business, but still shoulder to shoulder on both sides for a longhaul. 

[Little Evil]

Huh....so I'm not up to pace on the recent gossip on the US Airways devaluation, but I just got yet another email from them saying that some redemption rates have actually gone down, and that the 120 business class to South Asia from US still seems intact on OneWorld. In fact, the new US Airways OneWorld chart doesn't even start until 6/1/14, so that would almost sound like this new chart might be in place for a while. Crossing my fingers to stay at 120k for a long while. Am I reading this right? 

 

http://www.usairways.com/en-US/dividendmiles/usemiles/awardchart.html

[fatjack1]

Good point. No direct path to get onto EVA via Chase Sapphire Preferred airlines. UA is still Star Alliance, but I have to take back that 120k I mentioned earlier. It would be 160k to book through UA, right? Last time I took UA on award I flew UA business longhaul to Korea, then Thai business from there to BKK. UA has pretty decent IFE. Seats aren't so bad either, but the arrangement is something less than desirable. Still have to do the "step over" or be stepped over when lounging or in bed mode. Avoid the center on wide bodies, as they still pack em in 4 deep in the center row. I'd hate to have to settle for one of the two center seats in that configuration. Business, but still shoulder to shoulder on both sides for a longhaul. 

 

I'm confused.  I "thought" I could just transfer my miles into my EVA mileage program.  Maybe I better look into that now.  it always sounds soooo good when they sign you up.

 

Fuck.  Just fuck.

 

I just checked and the 1-1 points for miles ONY applies to partner airlines.  Of which EVA is not.  There are only 5 partner airlines.  I assure you (I know read the print don't listen) I was told ANY airline when I selected this card.  Pricks.

 

So the 5 airlines I can choose are:

 

British Air - useless between USA and Thailand from the west coast.

United Air - business is 2-4-2 seating.  What a crock of shit.

Korean Air - crappy flight times and a 7:30 wait in Korea for the transfer

Virgin Air - to Thailand?

Southwest - well yeah I live in Southwest land but it doesn't have any long hauls.

 

Just fuck.

Edited April 8, 2014 by fatjack1

[Luv2Phuket]

I'm confused.  I "thought" I could just transfer my miles into my EVA mileage program.  Maybe I better look into that now.  it always sounds soooo good when they sign you up.

 

Fuck.  Just fuck.

 

I just checked and the 1-1 points for miles ONY applies to partner airlines.  Of which EVA is not.  There are only 5 partner airlines.  I assure you (I know read the print don't listen) I was told ANY airline when I selected this card.  Pricks.

 

So the 5 airlines I can choose are:

 

British Air - useless between USA and Thailand from the west coast.

United Air - business is 2-4-2 seating.  What a crock of shit.

Korean Air - crappy flight times and a 7:30 wait in Korea for the transfer

Virgin Air - to Thailand?

Southwest - well yeah I live in Southwest land but it doesn't have any long hauls.

 

Just fuck.

 

United's increases for Star Alliance suck ass -- 80,000 miles each way for biz class (20k increase) and 160k for RT (40k increase) -- BUT it is still an alternative, especially since you can do a one way award.  My last couple of trips, I did oneworld for one leg (usually the trip over) and Star Alliance for the other (usually the return).

 

AA allows one way bookings, but -- thus far -- US Air does not.

 

At 158k miles, you're almost at a RT award.  Maybe snag a few gift cards, then shift your money/charges/focus to an AA card?

 

The real killer in the devaluation was for first class -- that is now all but out of the question for me, even as a miles whore.

 

I'm upset about the devaluation, but, with a massive tax bill, I just got another Ink card and hope to snag another 55,000 UR points shortly ($5k in charges; 50k in bonus points).  I have read time and again that getting it as a Visa (my original is a Mastercard) counts as a new "product" and you get the points, but I've been screwed twice on cards before, so I'm withholding judgment until the points are in my account.

 

My theory is this: given the choice between dropping 160k UR points on a RT business class ticket (and about $65 in taxes) OR paying about $1800-2000 to fly in premium economy, I'm gonna pick the UR points and business class every time.

[Luv2Phuket]

I'm confused.  I "thought" I could just transfer my miles into my EVA mileage program.  Maybe I better look into that now.  it always sounds soooo good when they sign you up.

 

Fuck.  Just fuck.

 

I just checked and the 1-1 points for miles ONY applies to partner airlines.  Of which EVA is not.  There are only 5 partner airlines.  I assure you (I know read the print don't listen) I was told ANY airline when I selected this card.  Pricks.

 

So the 5 airlines I can choose are:

 

British Air - useless between USA and Thailand from the west coast.

United Air - business is 2-4-2 seating.  What a crock of shit.

Korean Air - crappy flight times and a 7:30 wait in Korea for the transfer

Virgin Air - to Thailand?

Southwest - well yeah I live in Southwest land but it doesn't have any long hauls.

 

Just fuck.

 

 

BTW, you note that BA is useless from the West Coast -- they also tack on some BRUTAL taxes!

[fatjack1]

Thanks footypjman.  My problem is I don't want to fly United business class.  seating is 2-4-2.  What kind of crap is that?  Oh and I tried directly using the miles from Chase and guess what?  A biz class flight was like 600K miles that way but with any airline I grant you  Still, when am I ever going to reach that.   First class was 900K miles.  555555555 

 

Tell the truth I think I'd rather use Korean.  At least the seating is better even though flight times and layover suck ass compared to EVA.  And I can directly transfer miles 1-1.  When this months CC payment goes in I think I'm over 160K.  So, heck maybe next trip is Korean.  

 

At least I have time to ponder it.  I have my return on EVA in August already paid for so my next flight  booked will be BKK-LAX-BKK in November and January.

[Luv2Phuket]

I could be wrong, but I think Korean is going to take even more miles that using United miles on a Star Alliance carrier -- Thai, ANA, EVA, Asiana.

 

And to clarify, unless there was ANOTHER change that I am not aware of, the 160k figure I quoted above was to use United miles to book one of those carriers via Star Alliance; NOT to fly United.

[wackyjacky]

Your right, KA's program sucks. BA's has been pretty useless since they switched to Avios. It's excellent for short haul Econ though, as it's mileage based. It's also not bad for hotel redemption. As far as the Chase "any airline" thing. You can book any airline with UR points, but you'll get fucked without a kiss. Like I said before, if you don't want to get miles-raped, transfer UR points to UA, fly UA metal transpac, and Econ to BKK on one of their partners. Nothing good about it other than the fact that it beats the other options.

Edited April 9, 2014 by wackyjacky

[fatjack1]

Your right, KA's program sucks. BA's has been pretty useless since they switched to Avios. It's excellent for short haul Econ though, as it's mileage based. It's also not bad for hotel redemption. As far as the Chase "any airline" thing. You can book any airline with UR points, but you'll get fucked without a kiss. Like I said before, if you don't want to get miles-raped, transfer UR points to UA, fly UA metal transpac, and Econ to BKK on one of their partners. Nothing good about it other than the fact that it beats the other options.

 

OK, pretend you're taking to the slow class (you probably aren't far off  ),

 

What is UA metal transpac?  

 

If it means UA aircraft transpacific I guess you mean like to Japan and then use an econ flight from there to BKK.  If so I get it.  Might look into that except it STILL sucks ass to sit 2-4-2 in BUSINESS class.  How antiquated is that?  

 

But, if it saves $3500 versus another EVA ticket I might do it.

[wackyjacky]

Might be time to familiarize yourself with UA's Award Chart. LINK: http://www.united.com/web/en-US/content/news/United-Award-Chart-02-01-14.pdf

[Luv2Phuket]

fatjack - 

 

Another option is to contact a booking service (like PointsPros -- www.pointspros.com), tell them you have X number of UR points )and however many United, AA and whatever else miles you may have) and want to fly business class to Asia on whatever dates you want to go.  It costs you $200 but can save you a ton of aggravation and digging, if you're new to the "game."

 

I used them once before when I could find nothing, and they got me to/from BKK in style (although I literally flew around the World -- went East heading to BKK and came back over the Pacific).

 

Unless they have changed their pricing structure/model, you pay nothing unless they find you an acceptable itinerary.  You do have to give them access to your frequent flier account, but, once the ticket is booked, you can go back in and change your password to put your mind at ease.  I ahve referred multuiple people to them and none have ever had an incident (but there';s a first time for everything)

 

As noted above, I think they will steer you to a Star Alliance carrier using 160k United miles (page 3 of the link in wackyjacky's post) 

Edited April 9, 2014 by footypjman

[fatjack1]

Thanks footypjman.  I'll check into them.

[Little Evil]

Thanks footypjman.  I'll check into them.

 

 

I've used PointsPros on my last two or three trips. Took FPJM's advise on them. Works as advertised. Give them trip parameters, including "must haves" and "would like to have" itinerary features. They'll return with a few options. I was even able to specify that I wanted the Royal Laurel seats instead of Premium Laurel seating and approximate layover times. Yes, I suppose with enough time and effort, one might be able to replicate this themselves, but I swear they are able to tap a deeper resource pool in terms of availability and plane info. I tried myself on the last trip and could only find horrible itineraries with 30+ our layovers in Frankfurt or Dubai. They did bump up in price this year, so I'd still recommend giving it a shot yourself first.

 

As far as EVA is concerned, you still have UA as a 1:1 partner for CSP, and can get to EVA via Star Alliance. That's most likely the option whether or not you book yourself or Points Pros. Only other ways to translate are Marriott Points to US Airways miles (at a deep loss) or Points.com (at a deep loss). 

[Luv2Phuket]

After the 2 calls I just had with US Air, I doubt that I will be buying any more US Air miles.

 

I use BA's Avios system to search for oneworld availability -- it shows first class availability one day that I was looking at (160k RT) and business class (multiple seats) another day (the dates are almost a year out -- next February).  In the past, I have always been able to use AA to book whatever Avios shows as available, which makes sense -- the limited seats that Cathay makes available are available to all oneworld members.

 

NOT according to US Air's phone reps -- they claim that US Air only gets allotted a certain number and that, even though Cathay has available seats through oneworld, they are NOT available using Dividend Miles.  I have never heard anything like this, so I tried again and got the same song and dance.   

 

Maybe that IS their policy, but I can't help but doubt it.  

 

Very disappointing, especially since US Air's website is absolute shit when it comes to finding flights -- Bangkok isn't an option, even if you choose the "US Air and partners" option.

 

It looks like my US Air "war chest" might sit until I can transfer/convert them to AA miles, where I have had MUCH better luck in booking trips (basically, if Avios shows it available, AA has always allowed me to book it).

 

Hmmm....now I may regret not jumping on more US Air miles when I had the chance!

 

I decided to circle back with US Air after reading this blog entry:  http://boardingarea.com/onemileatatime/2014/04/14/is-us-airways-blocking-oneworld-award-space/

 

Although it took FOREVER to get it "priced," I was finally able to book a trip for next February -- roundtrip on Cathay from LAX to BKK in first class for 160,000 US Air miles & $107 in taxes & fees.  

 

Business class goes for 120,000 miles and the service is great, but I couldn't resist getting the extra comfort of Cathay first class (which is absurdly nice!) for 40,000 miles.  To put it into perspective, with the 100% bonus offer I got on transfers last time at 1.1 cents per mile, it was like paying around $440 to bump up to first class.  I'm concerned that the new mileage charts will push first class out of reach for me (like United did with Star Alliance).  Plus, I'm still "only" paying the same effective rate as business class on Star Alliance.

 

US Air is running another promotion, but it is targeted.  Going back to the OP, assuming you can get the 100% bonus on buying miles, it works out to about 1.8 cents per mile.  At that rate, the 160,000 miles for Cathy first class is a not-so-cheap $2,880 (business class at 120,000 miles is $2,160).  Then again, I just priced the exact same itinerary that I have booked on Cathay's website, and it came out to $23,810.66.....at over 750,000 baht, that's a LOT of STs!

 

My flight time going out SUCKS ass -- the flight I like to take had no availability in first class, so I have to leave around 11:30 a.m. on a Friday, and I get into BKK right at midnight on Saturday night (as opposed to leaving LAX at around midnight & getting into BKK at around noon).  I'll have access to some SWEET showers in the Cathay first class lounge in HKG, so I should hit the ground running when I get to Pattaya at around 2 a.m.

[navidnavid]

What's up mile whores.

 

Once you reach intermediate status in the miles game you learn about certain sweet spots of particular programs.

 

BA Avios are great for short domestic flights, and you don't get charge the crazy taxes (fuel fees) if you use  Avios to travel to South America.

 

I got about 105,000 AA miles and plan on booking a CX award to BKK. I may buy a few thousand miles so I can fly first there, and business back. After all you get the best value out of your miles when you redeem for premium cabin seats.

 

 

Yo Footy, I plan on applying for the 100,000 bonus  Citi AA card when I get back from my trip, will the fact that I have had 2 previous Citi AA cards in the last year affect my chances at all? Do you have any experience with that? Enjoy that CX flight man, their service looks great, can't wait for my turn. 

[Luv2Phuket]

Yo Footy, I plan on applying for the 100,000 bonus  Citi AA card when I get back from my trip, will the fact that I have had 2 previous Citi AA cards in the last year affect my chances at all? Do you have any experience with that? Enjoy that CX flight man, their service looks great, can't wait for my turn. 

 

 

YMMV, but that was NO issue for me.  In fact, I had added a new AA business card (50k bonus) shortly before getting the 100k Citi World Elite, and have 2 personal AA cards.  

 

My understanding is that it is a entirely new/different product, so you still get the bonus....buuuuuut...ask me in about a month, as I haven;t gotten the miles yet (right around minimum spend if I haven't already hit it)

 

On a different subject, check your AA cards to see if they are the ones that get you a 10% rebate on miles used.  If so, that's a nice perk, as you max out the rebate and get 10,000 AA miles put back into your account after a RT to BKK (max is 10k miles per year).

 

At 55k each way in business and only 67.5k for first class, it's a HELLUVA deal even without the rebate, but WITH the rebate, you'd be out of pocket only 112,500 miles RT.  Can't beat that!

 

Finally, speaking of BA Avios, their website is the best that I have found for checking oneworld availability.

[wackyjacky]

Always better to fly 1st back. I find it helps with the 'PPD' (Post Pattaya Depression). On the way tp BKK, you're excited as shit and Biz is good enough.

[Little Evil]

Hmmm....now I may regret not jumping on more US Air miles when I had the chance!

 

I decided to circle back with US Air after reading this blog entry:  http://boardingarea.com/onemileatatime/2014/04/14/is-us-airways-blocking-oneworld-award-space/

 

Although it took FOREVER to get it "priced," I was finally able to book a trip for next February -- roundtrip on Cathay from LAX to BKK in first class for 160,000 US Air miles & $107 in taxes & fees.  

 

Business class goes for 120,000 miles and the service is great, but I couldn't resist getting the extra comfort of Cathay first class (which is absurdly nice!) for 40,000 miles.  To put it into perspective, with the 100% bonus offer I got on transfers last time at 1.1 cents per mile, it was like paying around $440 to bump up to first class.  I'm concerned that the new mileage charts will push first class out of reach for me (like United did with Star Alliance).  Plus, I'm still "only" paying the same effective rate as business class on Star Alliance.

 

US Air is running another promotion, but it is targeted.  Going back to the OP, assuming you can get the 100% bonus on buying miles, it works out to about 1.8 cents per mile.  At that rate, the 160,000 miles for Cathy first class is a not-so-cheap $2,880 (business class at 120,000 miles is $2,160).  Then again, I just priced the exact same itinerary that I have booked on Cathay's website, and it came out to $23,810.66.....at over 750,000 baht, that's a LOT of STs!

 

My flight time going out SUCKS ass -- the flight I like to take had no availability in first class, so I have to leave around 11:30 a.m. on a Friday, and I get into BKK right at midnight on Saturday night (as opposed to leaving LAX at around midnight & getting into BKK at around noon).  I'll have access to some SWEET showers in the Cathay first class lounge in HKG, so I should hit the ground running when I get to Pattaya at around 2 a.m.

 

I'm typically down to share, pretty much any time. I can never refuse miles at 1.1 cents a pop. If that pops up again in the near future, drop me a line. I missed this last one because my only other friend who collects Dividend miles was mileage broke at the time and wouldn't be able to reciprocate. I was wondering if I transferred him 50K, could he then just transfer that back to me? Didn't want it backfiring in case it wasn't allowed. All these back to back promotions do raise an eyebrow, but considering US Airways released their updated award chart, I think we should be safe for at least the next 6 months. 

 

I got that email about the new promotion for buy or gift miles, but I got shafted again with 75% bonus. WTF!  Of the last three variable rate bonuses, I only got 100% once. That is, assuming we are talking about the same thing. The one I'm talking about it through 4/30.  

 

Anyway, I would love to try out Cathay first class one day. Both the hard and soft products look amazing, and I continually read that service is astounding. I've only ever flown domestic first  and first class to central America. Both of those routes typically fly narrow body jets with the leather barcalounger seats. Nothing to write home about.

[navidnavid]

Always better to fly 1st back. I find it helps with the 'PPD' (Post Pattaya Depression). On the way tp BKK, you're excited as shit and Biz is good enough.

 

 

 Flying first is a great way start to your trip. Then on the way back Biz class will do, as you are just going home and you can think of all the  great memories. 

[Luv2Phuket]

I'm cutting and pasting this from another thread, as it "kinda" pertains to this one, as well:

 

For those getting started in the "credit card miles game," Chase has just bumped the bonus on the Ink Bold and Ink Plus business credit cards to 60,000 after $5,000 minimum spend in the first 3 months (up from the typical 50,000 they offer).

 

Here's a great blog entry discussing it, and contained therein is a link to another entry on how/why you should have small business credit cards:
http://boardingarea....hase-ink-cards/

 

Factoring in the minimum spend, that's 65,000 points that transfer 1:1 to United.  Granted, United's devaluation of its Star Alliance award chart sucks ass, and you're not even half way to a RT business class ticket, but it's a start.  

 

I'm NOT suggesting that it is sane to do this, but, if you have the ability to "front load" $5,000 in spending, you could go to Staples/Office Depot and buy 25 $200 Visa, AMEX or Mastercard gift cards.  You're incurring the $5,000 charge immediately (+ an additional $173.75 in fees of $6.95/card), but can then use these cards to pay things off over a longer period of time.  With the "office supply" bonus of 5X the spend, that would end up netting you well over the 80,000 United miles needed for a one way business class seat from the USA to Bangkok (60,000 bonus points + 25,000 more for spending $5k on office supplies).

 

I buy these cards every now and then to help me hit minimum spends, but I think buying THAT many cards seems a little crazy (not to mention you're getting hit with a $5,000+ bill!)

 

Despite United's devaluation, I am hoping to tack another 120,000+ miles onto my account in the next few months via Ink cards for 2 separate businesses (unfortunately, I just got one about a month ago that only had a 50,000 point bonus).