Learning To Speak Thai.

[stray dog]

Coys, I had the opportunity to have a 2 year 'career break' in Thailand. I took 2 months of one to one lessons every other day. This gave me a good grounding, and maybe, more importantly the confidence to speak and study more. I am by no means fluent but can hold conversations and the satisfaction I have had is considerable. Truly glad I made the effort I hope you will be to, good luck!

[COYS]

Thanks for your replies.

 

Ningning: How often were you being taught and for how long? Are you saying that being immersed in Thai it has taken you 6 years to learn? I was under the impression that it can be learned in 9-12 months (ie. become fluent)

 

Stray Dog: Thanks for that. I'm sure that I'll get a great deal out of learning whatever stage I get to.

 

COYS

[NINGNING]

Thanks for your replies.

 

Ningning: How often were you being taught and for how long? Are you saying that being immersed in Thai it has taken you 6 years to learn? I was under the impression that it can be learned in 9-12 months (ie. become fluent)

 

Stray Dog: Thanks for that. I'm sure that I'll get a great deal out of learning whatever stage I get to.

 

COYS

Well, I started learning Thai 6 years ago.

One evening I was sitting with my girl of the night in an open air bar in WS and opposite of us there was a similar couple: A young guy in his mid-20s and a beautiful Thai girl. They were sitting next to each other, drinking. Communication was only possible by gestures (he had her buying cigarettes for him). It was like a mirror of me and my girl at that time and I felt that I did not want to continue like that. Moreover I felt it boring to only drink and fuck and lose the day.

To understand the Thais you have to understand their culture and society but language is the major key.

 

So my first idea was to learn from a bargirl: I pay her for her service and learn the language along the way.

Smart, he? Nope, bad idea. They are not teachers and they have no clue about teaching, how to teach, what to teach.

Use them for practicing what you have learned, yes, but that’s it.

 

So I went to a school with the standard offer for a 20 hours course, 2 hours a day for 2 weeks.

You can find them everywhere in Pattaya. That was just right, because you have to add 2 hours for homework and your own preparations, which makes about 4 hours a day.

It is important that you find a teacher who you click with.

I have a teacher for about 6 years now and she became a close friend of mine which makes learning easier.

Once again, I think it’s vital that your teacher is a fully educated person and not a dropout from the barscene.

I had one-on-one lessons only when in Thailand which is for about 8 to 10 weeks a year. That allowed me to express almost everything after about 2-3 years – you can quickly learn the most often used words and thus combine phrases: No one expects you to speak perfectly, after all you are still a farang!

So according to my experience you are quite right with your 9-12 months impression mentioned above, but does not include reading and writing (or maybe only on a limited level).

Sometimes I have 3 hours a day (split into reading / conversation / grammar). I never missed a single lesson, sometimes I have a bad hangover or cannot concentrate (guess why ... )and my teacher understands it – as long as it does not happen too often. To learn at home I have bought a number of books, CD’s and PC-programs.

I personally feel, that major drivers for success are discipline and your own willingness. Don’t look for excuses why you cannot do your homework or cannot attend school.

Now I have reached a reasonable level, i.e. can speak fluently, can write, reading is the most difficult part for me. As said in my earlier post I feel that immersion is a really great idea but is a bit difficult as long as you stay in Pattaya. If you go to the province you might have more time at hand and a stronger need to learn, but then leaving Pty is no option.

Edited January 10, 2010 by NINGNING

[Dr.Winston]

Thanks for your replies.

 

Ningning: How often were you being taught and for how long? Are you saying that being immersed in Thai it has taken you 6 years to learn? I was under the impression that it can be learned in 9-12 months (ie. become fluent)

Stray Dog: Thanks for that. I'm sure that I'll get a great deal out of learning whatever stage I get to.

 

COYS

I think that's very optimistic. My memory from when I started learning in the late 80's was that it took a couple of years before everything seemed to fall into place, and I was living there for the latter part of those two years. For me the hardest stage is when it seems that the more you learn, the more you realise you don't know. That went on for ages and is a common observation in learners of Thai. The Thai script is key if you are serious about learning.

 

I can't remember how long it was before I became fluent, probably about 4 years for me but I only studied Thai for the first two. I haven't studied Thai since 1991 although I've lived there a few times in that period and get plenty of practise with my Thai to this day.

[COYS]

I think that's very optimistic. My memory from when I started learning in the late 80's was that it took a couple of years before everything seemed to fall into place, and I was living there for the latter part of those two years. For me the hardest stage is when it seems that the more you learn, the more you realise you don't know. That went on for ages and is a common observation in learners of Thai. The Thai script is key if you are serious about learning.

 

I can't remember how long it was before I became fluent, probably about 4 years for me but I only studied Thai for the first two. I haven't studied Thai since 1991 although I've lived there a few times in that period and get plenty of practise with my Thai to this day.

 

Too optimistic? Maybe. Not according to the course tutors though

But I think there is a huge difference between: a) attending a University immersion course full time in Bangkok for a year

and: b) learning in your own country and only getting to practice in Thai culture whilst on holiday.

 

Agreed, the whole learning curve will probably last a lifetime and not 1 year. But I think huge progress can be made in one year when you are devoted to a single subject day in, day out.

[Dr.Winston]

Too optimistic? Maybe. Not according to the course tutors though

But I think there is a huge difference between: a) attending a University immersion course full time in Bangkok for a year

and: b) learning in your own country and only getting to practice in Thai culture whilst on holiday.

 

Agreed, the whole learning curve will probably last a lifetime and not 1 year. But I think huge progress can be made in one year when you are devoted to a single subject day in, day out.

I have no doubt about that. Good luck with whichever method you choose, I really enjoyed studying Thai.

[Ajay75]

Too optimistic? Maybe. Not according to the course tutors though

But I think there is a huge difference between: a) attending a University immersion course full time in Bangkok for a year

and: b) learning in your own country and only getting to practice in Thai culture whilst on holiday.

 

Agreed, the whole learning curve will probably last a lifetime and not 1 year. But I think huge progress can be made in one year when you are devoted to a single subject day in, day out.

 

I think a year is a little optimistic to be to near any fluent level. As others have said it takes time to gradually develop an ear for tones and as you get more used to it you can understand more and more at normal conversational speed. This is the key for me as I've been learning with a teacher 1 to 1 for just over a year now and I have made great improvements. I spent a year speaking only and having been reading and writing a little for the last couple of months (which I'm glad I decided to learn). Actually reading isnt that bad once all the various vowel rules are understood.

 

Its hard work especially if you work as well and have to fit it in around that and having a social life as well. I personally dont think the classroom technique is a great idea other than if you are a beginner. You can learn all you want in a classroom but it wont prepare you for the real world IMO. I've concentrated most of my Thai on everyday conversational stuff which has helped greatly. An hour is the most I do in any one session as anymore your brain doesnt take it all in and concentration levels drop. I sometimes do more but will split it up into 30-45 min sessions through the day.

 

As previous posters have mentioned and I've also read a few articles on becoming truly fluent, using immersion by living and interacting in the country for a number of months can push you that last bit you need.

 

Some days are good during lesson time, some not so but its all part of the learning process. I've had plenty of times where I've felt like jacking it in or getting too frustrated about it all (have a look in the Thai section 555). But the important thing is to keep going and even though it seems like you dont think your getting anywhere it does gradually start to click into place. You have to bascially forget you know English and learn like a baby would. Forget all the rules that have been ingrained into your head when you learnt your first language and start with a blank canvas.

[herds]

"fluent" is too an ambiguous label to bestow, i've got english mates that I wouldn't say are fluent in english!

 

There's kids that would be classed as fluent, but that's only fluent with what they know, treat them to some medical or technical words and they'd be dumbfounded, the same way if you were to talk the way you do down the pub with a foreign (fluent in english) person they would likely struggle as soon as anything cultural appeared unless they'd been here for a long time.

 

A single word could knock someone off being fluent, so to be become truly fluent i.e. Native would take years and years. Be nice if it was like in the movies though.

Edited January 13, 2010 by herds

[Ajay75]

55 Herds. Although I have met a couple of Thai girls who could understand cokney slang which I was quite impressed with. But they had been learning English hardcore for about 5 years. But still was very imprressive that they knew the banter like we would have in the pub with our mates.

 

This is the sort of thing I push with my teacher. When I understand its quite unbelievable the amount of bad language that gets spoken in Thai soaps!!

[shoplifter]

get youre self thai girlfriend its the quickest and most fun way

[Ajay75]

.No this isn't always the best way. Too many bad habits can be picked up and will make you sound unintelligent from a Thai perspective, tBest to learm central BBK Thai for the future.

[herds]

if you're understanding what she is saying and then copying it then surely that makes you sound more like a native

[Ajay75]

The more I know the more I am cautious about repeating what I've heard. This is especially the case when watching Thai Soaps as they try and tailor their language to the "street" level which if I spoke half of the little particals they speak to eachother to a stranger I would probably be in A&E. It amazes me how much bad langauge is used in these programs and also in some films as well.

 

I actually cringe with some of the stuff I remember saying when I first started learning with Thais but I think its something we all go through and is part of the natural learning process. I am so glad that I have learnt this language over the last year and hope by my second year that the progress will even more noticeable. My reading has come on alot but writing is pretty slow but I've only really taken on this challenge since Dec last year.

[herds]

writing because of spelling difficulties yeah? have you the thai language pack installed on your PC/mac?

 

the only impolite particle I think you have to watch is วะ/wa and even that isn't really something that would get you in trouble

Edited February 5, 2010 by herds

[Ajay75]

writing because of spelling difficulties yeah? have you the thai language pack installed on your PC/mac?

 

the only impolite particle I think you have to watch is วะ/wa and even that isn't really something that would get you in trouble

 

No mate i haven't got that pack installed. I find writing difficult due to all the silent letters that appear as it just seems to be a case of memorising certain words which use them.

 

555 believe me "wa" and "ba" will get you into enough trouble with strangers. I wouldn't dare say them and would even be careful about using them with close friends. I'm watching "Kaew tah pii" at the moment and there is one woman who has said alot worse than the above. Loads of "you bitch" "you will die" etc etc.

 

Its so difficult with soaps as they try and connect with the street level slang and on the other hand use sentences which are over dramatic as its for effect. Hence if you copied and used in every day life people would think you were a bit mental or rude in some circumstances.

[herds]

I've just found spelling pretty much something that you learn by repetition and seeing the word enough times, I still miss out the odd tone mark or for example a ข instead of a ค on even the simplest words, just takes a while. I would use the word "memorising" as well actually, especially for the clusters and ones which have no way of discerning whether they are open or closed until you hear them or read the phonetic translation.

 

I think "you bitch" would probably get you into trouble in any language, heh.

 

I found Thai's generally are a lot more polite to one another than we are, this is especially true when speaking to a group or when you're first meeting people however didn't find it as extreme as you make out. After about a year in Thailand I started actually learning thai properly from books etc and was kinda shocked at how I 'should' be speaking, all the polite particles, grammar etc etc I've been missing out by way of copying, but soon after using all these new found tit-bits of knowledge I was advised that it's better to sometimes leave these out when talking to friends as otherwise you can come across as quite formal. I think you'll always be let off and generally given the benefit of the doubt if you're farang anyways, unless you steam in with obvious bad words and have a sufficient grasp for them to feel you know what you're saying.

 

Thai soaps are something else hey, complete and utter drivel. Usually when I say "just copy thais" I should really put an asterix by that, a grasp of what exactly was said needs to be attained first and also if you're unsure of the words then check them out, I think if you were just starting off this could be deadly

 

Saying all this I really do need to remember not to use โคตร or โคตรๆ sometimes, that word is so ingrained in me. It's nearly as bad as when i'm touch-typing in english and I press 'ม'(,) repeatedly expecting an 'm' to appear, heh.

Edited February 6, 2010 by herds

[GeeMan]

I applaud your enthusiasm, but I feel 36 hours a week is a somewhat aggressive schedule, as well as possibly be counter-productive. That many hours per week could be more 'new' learning than you could reasonably absorb. As for the immersive nature of such a schedule, you should get all that immersion for free everywhere you go

 

I only know one language, and have never attempted to learn a foreign language beyond a couple of terms of Latin and French in high school. All now forgotten. I do recall that I never felt I had a natural aptitude. As such, I've always thought I would go for between 4 - 8 hours a week and take several month to get a basic grasp of day 2 day communication.

 

Best of luck and let us know how you get on

 

GeeMan

 

Right, so since my previous reply to the OP I have started trying to learn Thai from the Pimsleur material.

 

Man, my recollection of my lack of natural aptitude for languages seems to accurate. While I am enjoying the lessons (finished number 6 tonight) and am still very motivated (practising from memory every day during my lunch time walks), I'm not finding it easy.

 

I've done every lesson twice, the first time the 1/2 hour session generally takes between 60 and 120 minutes, the second pass about an hour. But I pause the lesson after each prompt and repeat the response several times before continuing. I feel this method works best for me personally, as I'm no natural at this and twice over lets me progress without blank outs on the next lesson.

 

I also take quite a lot of my own notes, and tend to revise them quite a bit as subsequent lessons prove some of my earlier assumptions flawed. An example is the grammar - I'm still struggling with the correct usage of mai vs. mai-chai for negative responses.

 

But overall I'm happy with Pimsleur; it has kept me engaged and motivated, it builds on previous lessons well, and I'm kind of excited about practising my new-found knowledge on my next trip with real people. A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing

 

GeeMan

Edited May 27, 2010 by GeeMan

[lutbon_sawng_loo]

f you are exposed to hearing and seeing Thai for nine months to a year, you will be able to speak and generally understand what is being said and to read signs, but to read and write it properly will take at least another two to three years. Reading the irregular script is difficult, but it is not as difficult as Thai people may tell you, I have had several people in Thailand (native and westerner) tell me that the written script is too difficult/different for a non-Thai to learn, which is an exaggeration and of course, not true.

 

Ive started learning thai and am planning on doing a year in thailand. I plan on learning for a year here then go there for a year and only use the thai language.

 

some links for you:

http://how-to-learn-any-language.com/e/languages/thai.html

http://www.prolanguage.co.th/courses/thai-courses/

http://www.learningthai.com/speak_thai.html

 

At the moment im listening to pimsleur 30 mins a day, and using the book "thai for beginners" 30 mins a day, that way im getting the pronunciation right and also learning to read and write thai script.

Plus at an hour a day it all seems to go in

[Ajay75]

Right, so since my previous reply to the OP I have started trying to learn Thai from the Pimsleur material.

 

Man, my recollection of my lack of natural aptitude for languages seems to accurate. While I am enjoying the lessons (finished number 6 tonight) and am still very motivated (practising from memory every day during my lunch time walks), I'm not finding it easy.

 

I've done every lesson twice, the first time the 1/2 hour session generally takes between 60 and 120 minutes, the second pass about an hour. But I pause the lesson after each prompt and repeat the response several times before continuing. I feel this method works best for me personally, as I'm no natural at this and twice over lets me progress without blank outs on the next lesson.

 

I also take quite a lot of my own notes, and tend to revise them quite a bit as subsequent lessons prove some of my earlier assumptions flawed. An example is the grammar - I'm still struggling with the correct usage of mai vs. mai-chai for negative responses.

 

But overall I'm happy with Pimsleur; it has kept me engaged and motivated, it builds on previous lessons well, and I'm kind of excited about practising my new-found knowledge on my next trip with real people. A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing

 

GeeMan

 

Ahh the good old Pimslar 555. I spent many an hour going through doing exactly what you are doing. It probably took me around 3 months of pretty dedicated revision and regular reviews to get through all the lessons and making sure they stuck. I can still recall some of the conversation examples now. Good place to start but is a little dated now and people don't really speak like that in real life.

 

In answer to your question about mai and mai chai.

 

Use "mai" before a verb and "mai chai" before a noun or in answer to a question where "chai mai" (means roughly transalated as "correct?") is used

 

e.g.

 

pomV mai kriad (I'm not stressed)

 

pomV mai chay gay (I'm not gay)

 

Hope this helps

Edited May 28, 2010 by Ajay75

[joltme1313]

i took lessons 1hr a day five days a week and that was enough time to spend any more could be counter productive. These lessons were one to one which i think is far better, i was useless at languages at school but picked thai up fairly quickly because i wanted to. my teacher has a very western attitude and is very easy to get along with, she is also very good to know if you get any problems here, she helped me get rid of an unwanted girlfriend without getting police involved which could have been costly!! she charges about 4000 baht a month not sure exactly cause not had lessons before, pm me if you want telephone number.

 

 

 

 

 

where abouts did you take your lesson? bkk?

[peter.storm]

No. in Pattaya she has a condo on 3rd road.