Red v Yellow

[PepeLePew]

Very interesting article by a long term Asia correspondant

 

If you like this google him and look up his other stuff

 

 

 

 

Red v. Yellow by Joshua Kurlantzick

[Zieke Reiger]

great article and a grim view of things to come...

[PepeLePew]

great article and a grim view of things to come...

 

Yes, the political situation doesn't look great for the future.

 

That said as a visitor I have been in country during times of riots, protest and military coup. I have never felt threatened by any of it and would not put off a visit because of any of it.

 

The part that concerns me though is the situation in the south.

[vmm]

Thaksin's misdoings seem pretty tame compared to the current governments flaws..

 

there's no going back to stifling the poor anymore, at least some goals of the reds must be achieved before things can calm down.

[Al.]

Thaksin's misdoings seem pretty tame compared to the current governments flaws..

 

there's no going back to stifling the poor anymore, at least some goals of the reds must be achieved before things can calm down.

 

I dont want to get involved in any arguments and I'm not taking sides what I am about to say is I know over simplistic so feel free to contradict me also as a foreigner it is none of my business.

 

Forget the actual names of the political party's basically you have the Reds Shirts (Poor underprivileged mainly from the north & north east) & the Yellow Shirts (Elite rich upper & middle class the established ruling class with all the traditional money & power mainly based in Bangkok) the Yellow Shirts also it has been rumoured seem to think the Red Shirts should not be allowed a vote because according to them they are uneducated & do not know what they are voting for.

 

The Red Shirts in their opinion do have a genuine grievance, just a few points they have raised,

 

A democratically elected government was overthrow by the military, they claim the present government & Prime Minister was not democratically elected but is in their opinion a puppet government of the military following the coup in 2006.

 

The Red Shirts Party (Thai Rak Thai) was accused of buying votes & disbanded by the courts (controlled by the yellow shirts) but the Yellow Shirts who were also involved with vote buying were never even accused let alone prosecuted.

 

Red Shirt leaders have been prosecuted and are now serving prison sentences following demonstrations a few years ago, but the Yellow Shirts they are the ones who occupied shut down the airports and done far more harm to the reputation and economy of Thailand have not even been prosecuted let alone convicted, in fact one of them has been rewarded with a ministerial position in the present government.

 

The courts and government change the laws and constitution to suit themselves and give them (yellow shirts) either immunity or an unfair advantage and keep them in power.

 

Despite the military Junta who were responsible together with the courts for disbanding the Red Shirts Party (THai Rak Thai) and banned TRT executives from contesting in the elections for five years. In the 2007 elections the newly formed Red Shirts party PPP won 233 out of 480 of the MP's seats. The Democrat Party (now the government) were second with 165 seats. Wikipedia

The Red Shirts are saying all they want is for the present (in their opinion illegal) government to be disbanded and for new elections to called. They have stated they would accept any outcome provided the elections were fair and above board.

In my opinion

The Yellow Shirts do not really want true democracy or to lose the power they have at the moment and will do all they can to keep it.

The Yellow Shirts would most likely be better at running the country that the Red Shirts but that is not the issue the party that deserves to run the country is the one that is elected by the people to do so.

There may only be around 60,000 Red Shirts in Bangkok at the moment but there are millions more that support them especially in the north and north east I just hope it doesn't get out of control. As for the army they may support the government at least the top brass does but do the troops on the ground?

Al.

[farang1]

A very informative article that should be read by all farangs visiting LOS. However, I wonder why, given the economic contraction and political turmoil mentioned in the article, the baht always gains against Western currencies? Also, nothing is mentioned in the article about the charge that, according to my understanding, brought Thaksin down: the fact that he had committed some type of major tax swindle that cost the treasury billions of baht.

[whitespider - RIP]

Thaksin's misdoings seem pretty tame compared to the current governments flaws..

 

 

I dont want to make any excuses for Thaksin, I am sure he was corrupt.

 

However people forget : he was removed illegally, he was tried by 4 judges appointed by the military. The same set of judges (effectively) installed the current government. If he had been tried by his own people the result would have been totally opposite.

 

I dont want excuses for him but I am 99% sure he got no fair trial and what he did receive wouold have been laughed out of court anywhere else.

 

Like most of us I hate the current protests but if democracy is indeed "the will of the people" then I have to say that I think they are correct in what they seek. The majority of Thailand is poor and the majority should have the right to be properly represented.

 

To those Yellows who argue (IMO despicably) that the "uneducated" should not have the same voting rights as them I say one thing - "educate them then".

[robotgerbil]

Pardon my ignorance here, I am very new. My entire knowledge of these troubles is a few newspaper and TV articles. However, my question is what is the actual significance of the colours? Presumably the reds are left wing (socialist/communist?) - that I get. But why yellow? Blue would seem a more logical opposition to the red left - or am I missing something about Thai culture here?

[PepeLePew]

Pardon my ignorance here, I am very new. My entire knowledge of these troubles is a few newspaper and TV articles. However, my question is what is the actual significance of the colours? Presumably the reds are left wing (socialist/communist?) - that I get. But why yellow? Blue would seem a more logical opposition to the red left - or am I missing something about Thai culture here?

 

Yellow is the Kings colour. You may or may not know the extremly high regard the King is held by all Thais. In essence the yellow side simply took his colour first! That aside the yellows are predominantly the middle and upper classes, the military and the beaurocracy who, rumour has it, have the support and more importantly the ear of the king.

[PepeLePew]

Pardon my ignorance here, I am very new. My entire knowledge of these troubles is a few newspaper and TV articles. However, my question is what is the actual significance of the colours? Presumably the reds are left wing (socialist/communist?) - that I get. But why yellow? Blue would seem a more logical opposition to the red left - or am I missing something about Thai culture here?

 

 

It is not just red and yellow shirts either, read this

 

The non United Colors of Thailand

 

 

 

Amusingly there are a lot of man U, Arsenal and Liverpool supporters amongst the Thais, apparently many are now reluctant to wear their colours so as not to be seen to be supporting one side or another. Luckily not too many Norwich fans!

[bbd]

Very interesting article.

 

Maybe Thailand needs to be divided into different regions,like the United Kingdom.

 

United Kingdom Of Thailand! Sounds good to me!

Edited April 9, 2010 by bbd

[Temujin]

Great piece. Thanks for posting.

[TGluvver]

Pardon my ignorance here, I am very new. My entire knowledge of these troubles is a few newspaper and TV articles. However, my question is what is the actual significance of the colours? Presumably the reds are left wing (socialist/communist?) - that I get. But why yellow? Blue would seem a more logical opposition to the red left - or am I missing something about Thai culture here?

 

 

Why does red have to equal communist??

 

Sure the red shirts have a social agenda, but I do not believe they are even remotely communist.

[PepeLePew]

Why does red have to equal communist??

 

Sure the red shirts have a social agenda, but I do not believe they are even remotely communist.

 

No, they aren't communist, to be honest I'm not that au fait with specific policies. I guess we can assume that the yellows, being the elite and upper classes are more right wing and the reds, representing the poor and the manual workers are leftist/socialist. I do know Taksin helped out the poorer rural communities but to be honest that could have been his only leftist policy. I know his policies towards certain crimes were pretty facist! Hmmmm, can anyone think of a political movement that was both facist and socialist at the same time? (joking, lets not even go there!)

[headcheck]

Thanks for the article. It's a matter of who's less wrong then? Just push the polls forward and put a stamp on it without provoking anything anymore.

[george671]

The reds (and Taksin) were angry that PM Taksin was deposed with out due process (via a military coup of course)...They have contended that all governments since that day have been a sham...The yellows were in exhistance prior to PM Taksin's leaving Office...Yellow became a traditional color to show support for the Monarchy...Prime minister Shinawatra (Taksin)during his regime made some remarks on several occasions that may have caused concern in the Royal family (and much of Thai society for that matter)at that time....Some noted comments were made (indirectly of course) by His Majesty during his birthday address a few years back that also brought light on Shinwatra's so called reckless actions... It did not help that PM Taksin also did some buissiness deals (like selling off his satelite communications company to Singapore with out paying any taxes or for that matter with out proper government approval). Anyway the polical unrest will likely comtinue untill a bonafide general election with candidates and parties representing all sides are held...

 

Just my fifty cents worth...

 

Cheers

 

P.S. I remember back in the 70's when PM Seni Pramoj (Kukrit) was deposed by military coup, Tanks were rolling downtown and many Thamassat university students were killed. along with several soldiers and other civilians, Martial law was in effect for quite sometime if my memory serves me... That was outright Kaos, but the coutry still survived...lets see, the generals involved were Prapass, Narong, and Thanom Kitikachorn...please excuse my spelling.

Edited April 25, 2010 by george671

[PepeLePew]

I have the feeling this is gonna roll on and on, no matter if there are elections and whoever wins them!