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The Chinese don't give a damn....


Tao 66

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http://uk.news.yahoo.com/5/20091228/tuk-death-row-briton-learns-he-faces-exe-45dbed5.html

 

All appeals for Clemency in this case look set to fail and he has been told he will die withing 24 hours. Despite having Bi Polar disorderand mental health issues. Looking at the case the guy was fooled and his fragile mental state makes him delusional and vunerable. All it took was a few lies from a Chinese drugs gang and he acted as a mule for them.

 

Whether or not you think the guy should be executed (and I don't for the record) there are 2 things that are quite clear.

 

1.Stay away from drugs if you visit China...I know Mongers go there.

2. The Chinese don't give a toss...do the crime you do the time or in this case die.

 

No one can mess with the Chinese...I remember hearing a story about a US spyplane that crashed in China. it simply disappeared and when they wanted it back it stayed disapppeared!

 

There was a recent insurgent uprising in China with some islamic extremists...it was squashed brutally and quickly...ddin't hear much bleating about it after.

 

China can do what it likes, when it likes and how it likes..they are still happily camped in Tibet despite "pressure" from outside.

 

It's the World's most powerful nation without a shadow of a doubt.

IF ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL WHERE IS THE REST OF MY PENIS?

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I know what you mean in this case.......If they told us we should execute our cooks we would say piss off..thier rules and laws...

 

but it does make you wonder where is the common sense and the understanding as not all people and their circumstances are the same.

 

 

my thoughts for what they are worth.

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Their rules, you visit someone's country you abide by their rules or you face their penalties... This guy would have most probably been made aware on the plane about strict drug rules in China... He didn't follow them. Period.

 

To me it seems the lawyers are tying whatever they can to get the guy free. He probably wanted to be a big timer. There are consequences for everything... He knew the rules of the game before he played it....

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No one is guilt off any thing any more , always a reason but like others said you follow the laws off the country your in..

 

Wait and see maybe we offer something to bring him back as a hero, not seen much off PM brown. this Xmas , am sure he like to be on telly just before new year...

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As harsh as the laws are

When entering another country you need to respect and obey their laws.

with a disorder or not, he broke the law and he needs to pay price.

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I agree

 

Time spent in a Chinese prison will cetainly be no easy ride.

But the guy is deluded and pretty sick just don't think the Death Penalty is appropriate.

 

No one can mess with the Chinese

IF ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL WHERE IS THE REST OF MY PENIS?

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China has its own internal politics and agendas.

This is probably more about geopolitics and internal politics than the guys case.

They do very well to hide it but a lot of politics go on inside the government.

 

Ultimatly the guy smuggled drugs in a hard line country that carries the death penalty for such.

I feel for the guys family, but the world is full of injustice.

I'd rather the papers focused on some homeless lad who's been kicked out by an abusive father and is destined for a life on heroin before death in a doorway. There are plenty of others suffering who haven't done anything to deserve it.

 

We don't support the death penalty so we should petition the chinese. When they knock us back, thats end of story as far as i'm concerened. He knew what could happen if he did this, now its happened and we're supposed to feel sorry for him...

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Some people never learn to respect the laws of the country they are visiting and if you dont this happens, same goes for certain knob heads visiting thailand . Good on you China i got no time for drug smugglers/users. If you want to excute any more we in Uk have loads of these may be we can come to an agreement and ship all the duggies over to China and let them excute them ? and we also got a load of nonces here too maybe you can also excute thes cunts too ( take note Gordon brown and gary glitter), Akmal Shaikh sounds like a good old British name question1.gif , British by passport only not birth or culture . Looks more like Taliban than a home grown kent boy .

 

 

I am not a racist , just a realist in a fucked up country run by a fucked up government fucking us all the time Rant1.gif

 

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Their rules, you visit someone's country you abide by their rules or you face their penalties... This guy would have most probably been made aware on the plane about strict drug rules in China... He didn't follow them. Period.

 

To me it seems the lawyers are tying whatever they can to get the guy free. He probably wanted to be a big timer. There are consequences for everything... He knew the rules of the game before he played it....

 

Agreee totally with Robin here.. Do the crime, face the penalty..

Every action has an equal and opposite reaction - "it was just the internet.." is not an excuse.

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Some people never learn to respect the laws of the country they are visiting and if you dont this happens, same goes for certain knob heads visiting thailand . Good on you China i got no time for drug smugglers/users. If you want to excute any more we in Uk have loads of these may be we can come to an agreement and ship all the duggies over to China and let them excute them ? and we also got a load of nonces here too maybe you can also excute thes cunts too ( take note Gordon brown and gary glitter), Akmal Shaikh sounds like a good old British name question1.gif , British by passport only not birth or culture . Looks more like Taliban than a home grown kent boy .

 

 

I am not a racist , just a realist in a fucked up country run by a fucked up government fucking us all the time Rant1.gif

 

Oh I quite agree...we certainly need to fight against the onlsaughr of islamic fundamentalism and PC which is threatening our nation.

 

Also drug smuggling scum should face the due penalty of the country they smuggle drugs into...50 years in a thai monkey house or death Penalty

 

Seen some knob heads in Patts on a baht bus that made me feel ashamed to be english...send the fookers home.

 

I can't fly the flag of St George in the world cup because it's BNP.....yeah sure I get bloody angry

 

But I don't particularly care if the man is British or not...the facts are he is mentally ill and one wonders what the hell he is doing in China in the first place!

 

He's vunerable and has been taken advantage of...now has to pay the price.

 

Lock him, preferably in an institution, but death?sorry that's harsh.

 

As for the c**t who tried to blow up the plane in ths States....I'd pull the lever myself!! Or press the button or whatever

IF ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL WHERE IS THE REST OF MY PENIS?

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I find these death penalty debates pretty futile as people tend to hold entrenched and, frequently, emotional views on the matter. Personally, I do not support execution because it is - and long has been - a greatly abused weapon, generally applied to those of lower status and intelligence or to political opponents as a means to an end; as well as being applied often without any conclusive evidence of guilt. Have a read of John Grisham's The Innocent Man and marvel at the justice system and the application of justice in the most advanced nation still to apply the penalty on a regular basis.

 

In this particular case of Akmal Shaikh, it would appear that, under the Chinese legal system, a mentally-incapacitated person may well be awarded a bullet to the back of the head after a trial where no account was taken of that defendant's mental condition. From my perspective, irrespective of the defendant's race, creed, sex or beliefs, that is an immoral situation; but one that neither I, nor governments it seems, are able to do anything about.

 

As is usual in these Asian drug executions, the humble, penniless mule is left to 'bite the bullet', while the 'Mr Bigs' of the drug world reside in comfort and security and look for the next naive, destitute retard to undertake the next drug run. If the various authorities were to address the problem at the top and cull the big-shots, rather than stamping down on the little men, maybe I would feel more comfortable about death penalty applications than I do in cases like this one.

Edited by bocelli27

When a man is tired of Pattaya, he is tired of life.

 

An Agent of DOOM - defenders of older men

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If he is really mentally incapacitated then I feel for him and his family.

 

I am not in possesion of all the facts.

But right now I suspect its just a ploy by his lawyer.

I haven't heard of any evidence, life in a mental hospital, his carer assistants coming forward etc.

 

It also ask the question, how did this guy get to china all on his own? did he just walk out of hospital and onto a plane?

Surely the family wondered why he vanished from hospital? Who took him on the plane to china? Who bought the tickets?

 

My suspision is its about saving face. The chinese dont' want to set a pattern that their laws are overturned for foreign nationals.

But if we all agree he's a bit 'mental' then they chinese can change their minds and not loose face.

Maybe he wasn't the sharpest knife in teh drawer, but still able to holiday on his own without his family being concerned...

 

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

But I don't count him being a bit slow or any unsupported stories from his lawyer as proof he's mentality incapacitated.

Edited by hazze
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As told by the Guardian

 

Akmal Shaikh's journey from a minicab business in north London to death row in a remote part of north-west China is a labyrinthine tale involving eastern European gangsters, harebrained business schemes and a dream of international pop stardom.

 

It began in Kentish Town, north London, where Shaikh lived with his British wife and children. The couple ran a cab firm called Teksi on Fortess Road, close to Kentish Town tube station, and life appeared to be good.

 

Shaikh's former solicitor, Bruce Hayim, told the Observer earlier this year that Shaikh was once a "charming and charismatic man" – though the legal campaign group Reprieve insist he has "a lifelong history of very strange behaviour". His older brother, Akbar, said his sibling had shown signs of mental illness in 2001 after his first marriage had ended and "as he grew older he seemed to go off the rails". In 2004, he was accused of sexually harassing a female member of staff and ordered to pay £10,000 in unpaid wages and damages by an employment tribunal, according to his local paper, the Hampstead and Highgate Express.

 

But in 2005 Shaikh's life started to unravel further. He suddenly packed his bags and left for Poland, says his brother, where he announced plans to set up an airline despite having no means to do so. Given his complete lack of money, business plan or experience in the aviation industry, the venture soon foundered, but he was undeterred.

 

Having turned his back on his family, he stayed on, sometimes sleeping rough, moving from Lublin in the east to the capital, Warsaw. At some point he acquired a girlfriend, who told the Observer she soon became concerned by his "really silly and crazy" behaviour, such as the time he sent her a fake letter purporting to show he had won £1m.

 

He then started a prolonged email campaign, sharing his delusions with celebrities and government officials he had never met, firing off endless dispatches typed in an enormous 72-point font. Hundreds of emails sent by Shaikh to the British embassy in Warsaw from 2005 reveal the state of his mind. In the messages, obtained by Reprieve, he claimed to have spoken to the angel Gabriel and explained that he could have foiled the July 7 bombings in 2005, had he only been allowed to hold a press conference. One email appeared to be a letter to Father Christmas.

 

Some messages were copied in to a group of 74 organisations and individuals, including Tony Blair, Sir Paul McCartney, George W Bush and the BBC programme Top Gear.

 

But among the nonsense contained in the emails was information Shaikh's lawyers claim proves he had become involved with criminals who took advantage of his vulnerability. One mentioned a character called Carlos, who was going to help Shaikh achieve his dream of making it big in the music industry. Carlos, wrote Shaikh, had excellent contacts, and he knew a producer in Kyrgyzstan who could help him fulfil his dream of becoming a pop star. Though Shaikh had no singing experience, and even less musical talent, he recorded a song, an off-key track in English, Arabic and Polish called Come Little Rabbit, which, according to Reprieve, he truly believed had the potential to bring about world peace.

 

Today, two men who helped Shaikh record the song said it was clear he was psychiatrically ill. Gareth Saunders, a British teacher and musician who sang back-up on the song, said, "he clearly thought this song was going to have a very positive impact on the world".

 

He added: "It would be totally unlike him to get mixed up in drugs. However, it would be totally typical of him to fall for some kind of story that some drug dealer might spin to him concerning making his record in China … He would be so desperate for human contact that if some shady character came up to him to talk, Akmal would have gone on and on about his song, and it would have been easy for someone to see that he could be exploited."

 

It is Shaikh's case that back in 2007, "Carlos" told him that he knew people in the music industry that could assist and in September that year paid for a flight for Shaikh to Kyrgyzstan. There, his passport was taken by a gang of men – an act which did not unduly worry Shaikh, who believed he would soon be so famous that he would be recognised at every border crossing. When his passport was eventually returned, he was introduced to a man called Okole. This man, Shaikh claims he was told, ran a huge nightclub in China that would be the perfect venue for the debut performance of Come Little Rabbit.

 

En route to China, the two men stopped in Dushanbe, in Tajikistan, where they stayed in a five-star hotel – which Reprieve say Shaikh believed was a sign of his celebrity status. There, Okole told him he would have to fly to China alone as the flight was full. Shaikh claims Okole gave him a suitcase and promised to follow on the next flight.

 

On 12 September 2007, Shaikh flew into Urumqi and was stopped by customs officials on arrival. He was searched and his baggage scanned. Two packets containing around £250,000 worth of heroin were found in his luggage.

 

Shaikh told the officials that he did not know anything about the drugs, and that the suitcase did not belong to him. Reprieve say he helped the Chinese authorities with their inquiries and even set up a "sting" operation, telling Chinese officials to wait for Okole as he was due to arrive on the next plane. But Okole never turned up and Shaikh was arrested.

 

Though he was sentenced to death shortly after, the Foreign Office was not notified for many months, and in August 2008, Reprieve took on the case.

 

Chinese law says a defendant's mental state should be taken into consideration if they are accused of serious crimes, but the Chinese authorities have refused repeated requests for Shaikh to be evaluated by a doctor. At his first appeal hearing this May, Shaikh insisted on reading a long, rambling and often incoherent statement to the court. His performance was so strange that judges laughed.

 

Though he has never been assessed by a psychiatrist, Foreign Office officials were eventually allowed to spend 15 minutes with Shaikh. From their description of Shaikh's behaviour, Dr Peter Schaapveld, a London-based consultant clinical and forensic psychologist, compiled a medical report in which he was able to deduce with "99% certainty" that he was suffering from a mental disorder that could either be bipolar or schizophrenia. Despite that diagnosis, at 2.30am, Shaikh is due to be put to death.

I'd rather look at tits, cunts and arseholes than listen to them!

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Fair enough mate.

Thats a pretty soild case.

The guy does sound like a victim.

Though I do wonder why his family didn't try and find him when he was setting up airlines in poland.

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I find these death penalty debates pretty futile as people tend to hold entrenched and, frequently, emotional views on the matter. Personally, I do not support execution because it is - and long has been - a greatly abused weapon, generally applied to those of lower status and intelligence or to political opponents as a means to an end; as well as being applied often without any conclusive evidence of guilt. Have a read of John Grisham's The Innocent Man and marvel at the justice system and the application of justice in the most advanced nation still to apply the penalty on a regular basis.

 

In this particular case of Akmal Shaikh, it would appear that, under the Chinese legal system, a mentally-incapacitated person may well be awarded a bullet to the back of the head after a trial where no account was taken of that defendant's mental condition. From my perspective, irrespective of the defendant's race, creed, sex or beliefs, that is an immoral situation; but one that neither I, nor governments it seems, are able to do anything about.

 

As is usual in these Asian drug executions, the humble, penniless mule is left to 'bite the bullet', while the 'Mr Bigs' of the drug world reside in comfort and security and look for the next naive, destitute retard to undertake the next drug run. If the various authorities were to address the problem at the top and cull the big-shots, rather than stamping down on the little men, maybe I would feel more comfortable about death penalty applications than I do in cases like this one.

 

On the nose dude. I don't have a problem with the death penalty in principle, there are certainly those who deserve it. I just don't trust any judicial system to fairly use it. Those with money and connections will always get off easier than the little guy with none.

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And yet he's not so mentally incapacitated that he can't find his way to China. Wish I could go to China. I wouldn't get involved in drugs thats for sure.

 

All the poncey middle class guardianistas are out supporting him. He'll get a last minute reprieve and be back on benefit in the UK at the tax payers expense soon. Can anyone in the UK actually remember a Briton being executed abroad for drugs? They all get a reprieve and do some time there then get transferred here. And he's not really British. He might be travelling on an EU passport issued by the UKPA but he's not British. His name alone tells you that. He's no more British than the Xmas day bomber.

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:GoldenSmile1: WELL CHAPS.A what do we all think.WELLAll appeals for Clemency in this case look set to fail and he has been told he will die withing 24 hours. Despite having Bi Polar disorderand mental health issues. Looking at the case the guy was fooled and his ablfragile mental state makes him delusional and vunere. All it took was a few lies from a Chinese drugs gang and he acted as a mule for them.

Never heard off this disorder.HOW did the the chinese know he have it. ARE the chinese drugs gang docters.fragile mental state makes him delusional and vunereable.Like myself and maybe a few other people after a bottle off sang som and coke i am the the same.BUT I DONT DO DRUGS .RULE ONE He fucked up .All this money wasted on the news all over news papers MONEY to put into all these kids that are starving.MORE MORE AND MORE.HE IS A DRUG SMUGGLER

AND THEY KILL KIDS bye

chris

Wriggley Tin 1

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And yet he's not so mentally incapacitated that he can't find his way to China. Wish I could go to China. I wouldn't get involved in drugs thats for sure.

 

All the poncey middle class guardianistas are out supporting him. He'll get a last minute reprieve and be back on benefit in the UK at the tax payers expense soon. Can anyone in the UK actually remember a Briton being executed abroad for drugs? They all get a reprieve and do some time there then get transferred here. And he's not really British. He might be travelling on an EU passport issued by the UKPA but he's not British. His name alone tells you that. He's no more British than the Xmas day bomber.

 

Well, yes, I do actually:

 

7th of July 1986. Kevin Barlow (along with Australian Brian Chambers) were hanged in Malaysia's Pudu prison in Kuala Lumpur for drug trafficking, the first Briton to die for this offence.

21st of July 1989. Derek Gregory becomes the second and to date, last Briton to hang for drug trafficking, also in Malaysia.

 

Obviously, I bow to your superior knowledge on what constitutes a Briton these days, though it looks like we will be awfully short of doctors and nurses in the NHS when we boot out everyone named neither Brown, Smith, Jones nor derivaives of Mac / Mc.

Edited by bocelli27

When a man is tired of Pattaya, he is tired of life.

 

An Agent of DOOM - defenders of older men

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Well, yes, I do actually:

 

7th of July 1986. Kevin Barlow (along with Australian Brian Chambers) were hanged in Malaysia's Pudu prison in Kuala Lumpur for drug trafficking, the first Briton to die for this offence.

21st of July 1989. Derek Gregory becomes the second and to date, last Briton to hang for drug trafficking, also in Malaysia.

 

Obviously, I bow to your superior knowledge on what constitutes a Briton these days, though it looks like we will be awfully short of doctors and nurses in the NHS when we boot out everyone named neither Brown, Smith, Jones nor derivaives of Mac / Mc.

I can remember the time of those two executions well. When Derek gregory was hung I was on Koh Samui. I remember that Queen elizabeth II was due pay a Commonwealth visit to Malaysia that month so they speeded up the execution. Speculatively the reason was to avoid having to turn down any direct request for clemency she might make personally. Although there was never much doubt that he would have been hung anyway, it is alarming to see executions effected by unrelated politics.

 

If you look at the number of death sentences handed out and then who is actually executed it can seem so random. Take the US, one guy in one state will be executed for a murder that he wouldn't be executed for in the next state. There are situations in which I really believe somebody deserves to die but government sanctioned executions are often performed in a way that reminds me of a gruesome lottery.

         ความจริงเป็นสิ่งที่ไม่ตายแต่คนพูดความจริงอาจจะตาย                 

The truth is immortal but people who speak it aren't - Thai proverb

Karl's Thailand - My YouTube Channel

 

 

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sounds like a typical coke victim,lost in thoughts of untouchability and grandeur.tHE Chinese drug scene is not one of talking fantasy on a sunday afternoon in your typical british public house,a very difficult enviroment to be come involved in,you can see the consequences of drug play?bi polar yes a very sad affliction but not relevent in this case serves no purpose.Look at the misery of heroin in this country and question some of the new sudo rich?

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Well, yes, I do actually:

 

7th of July 1986. Kevin Barlow (along with Australian Brian Chambers) were hanged in Malaysia's Pudu prison in Kuala Lumpur for drug trafficking, the first Briton to die for this offence.

21st of July 1989. Derek Gregory becomes the second and to date, last Briton to hang for drug trafficking, also in Malaysia.

 

Obviously, I bow to your superior knowledge on what constitutes a Briton these days, though it looks like we will be awfully short of doctors and nurses in the NHS when we boot out everyone named neither Brown, Smith, Jones nor derivaives of Mac / Mc.

 

I remember neither but I don't doubt they happened. Were they guilty? If so they deserved it imho. If not, we can discuss further.

 

I have no "superior knowledge" but commonsense tells me that someone with the name Akmal Shaikh is more likely to be Asian/ so called (by Europeans) Middle Eastern than European. I can guesstimate many things based on those 2 names. In fact I can visualise his skin color (definitely NOT northern European) and general 'look' based on his name. For the record, I clicked the link, in the original post, ONLY after reading this thread. I was already familiar with the case from radio broadcasts but not TV. Sure enough he has that typical pale skinned 'northern european' swarthy look! He may well have an EU passport (not a british passport - no such thing exists anymore - I'm assuming that's why the media call him British) issued by UKPA. That's not the same as actually being British, though. DNA test him.

 

NB I'm Englisc, by the way.

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I remember neither but I don't doubt they happened. Were they guilty? If so they deserved it imho. If not, we can discuss further.

I remember seeing a documentary about Derek Gregory shortly before he was hanged. As I recall he was paid by somebody in England to make the run. he was caught because he hid the heroin in his boots and they were flapping at the airport in KL. They did brainscans and tried to get him off for being of low intelligence. In short, guilty.

 

Barlow and Chambers, I can't remember the specifics of the case but I believe they were guilty.

         ความจริงเป็นสิ่งที่ไม่ตายแต่คนพูดความจริงอาจจะตาย                 

The truth is immortal but people who speak it aren't - Thai proverb

Karl's Thailand - My YouTube Channel

 

 

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Politics aside, I am ethically opposed to the death penalty, as I believe that there is no deterrent to murder & the cost to society is greater than personal revenge (which has repeatidly been shown to provide no solace to the victim's family).

 

From the Guardian article, it seems that the guy is most likely schizophrenic, as opposed to bi-polar, as he is quite obviously delusional.

 

IMO I think that the treatment of the mentally ill will be seen as the 'holocaust' of the 20th / 21st century, in maybe a few hundred years time.

 

All the best. :001_Thank_You5:

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People who knowingly smuggle drugs deserve to die. I lived for 6 months with a Cocaine addict. One day he had some "bad shit" and smashed up half the house. My landlady had him prosecuted for criminal damage but what did the courts do? Fuck all. Conditional discharge and costs. His mental health deteriorated and he would lock himself in his room, armed with a hammer.

For some reason despite beating one of his mates half to death and attacking his girlfriend in a drug fuelled rage he seemed to trust me. I urged him to get help. Finally, thank God, he left the house voluntarily after I spent a while talking with him. So yeah I seen it first hand, it was very frightening to see what this shit can do. Eviction? forget it the landlady was shit scared of him and so were the bailiffs!

 

So drug smugglers who go out to destroy peoples lives should die.

 

I don't think this guy had a clue and was vunerable and easily led. he should be sectioned and cared for not executed.

The real criminals are the tossers who got him to carry the shit...death penalty appropriate

Edited by Tim42

IF ALL MEN ARE CREATED EQUAL WHERE IS THE REST OF MY PENIS?

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