Building a game plan to move from a Non-IM OA to a Non-IM O

[ChiFlyer]

I am trying to think through the best way of changing from an OA to an O Non-Im. Today I stopped by and talked to an agent that I had done business with before about the steps involved, which pretty much confirmed what I was already thinking.

• I obtained an OA about 6 years back and at that time there was no insurance requirement. The insurance requirement is my main reason for moving to an O. I view the available Immigration approved insurance options as being worthless in my case. Besides being expensive, they do not cover preexisting conditions. With my 73rd birthday coming up in a few weeks, I am nothing but a collection of preexisting conditions. I do have decent US health insurance that will cover me for ER and ER related inpatient in Thailand, but this is unacceptable to Immigration.
• I was thinking about doing this last October when I had to make a trip to the US, but decided not to because of all the potential Covid related issues.
• The way I see it, I need to void my OA. I plan on doing this by exiting Thailand, which will void the OA as I currently have no Reentry Permit. I then need to reenter on a 90 day O and then have the agent obtain a one year extension of stay. She quoted me 25,000 for that, which compares fairly to what I have heard others report.
• Some things that I am wondering about is where to exit to and how to apply for a visa from somewhere other than my home country. I really would like to avoid going all the way to the US at this time. I see my main candidates as being Viet Nam and Singapore. I have been to neither and I could potentially bring the GF with for a holiday. What concerns me is the length of time that would be needed before I could reenter Thailand.
• I actually have a decent amount of time to work this out, as my current Permission to Stay does not expire until mid-October. I figure the time to get the plan in place is now and not execute it at the last minute. Stuff happens and then some. 

@davidge you have been very helpful with this type of thing in the past. If you get a few minutes, please share your thoughts.

 

Edited May 3, 2022 by ChiFlyer

[penboy]

Do you mean coming back in on a Non Immigrant O? If so, the cost should be about half of the 25,000 quoted. 25K is when you come in visa exempt or on a tourist visa. This is what I was told by an agent a couple of months ago.

[ChiFlyer]

1 minute ago, penboy said:

Do you mean coming back in on a Non Immigrant O? If so, the cost should be about half of the 25,000 quoted. 25K is when you come in visa exempt or on a tourist visa. This is what I was told by an agent a couple of months ago.

I mean the cost for doing the one year Extension of Stay after coming in on a 90 day O. I would handle the initial 90 day O myself. The 25,000 for this level of service is pretty much what I was hearing from others pre-Covid. Also, I would not have a problem with paying this particular agent a small premium, as she has demonstrated several times before that she is well connected at Immigration and gets things done quickly and efficiently.

[penboy]

Just now, ChiFlyer said:

I mean the cost for doing the one year Extension of Stay after coming in on a 90 day O. I would handle the initial 90 day O myself. The 25,000 for this level of service is pretty much what I was hearing from others pre-Covid. Also, I would not have a problem with paying this particular agent a small premium, as she has demonstrated several times before that she is well connected at Immigration and gets things done quickly and efficiently.

The one year extension of stay is around the 12,500 mark.

Yes, you get the 90 day O in your home country. By getting it, there is less for the agent to do in getting the 1 year extension compared to VE or tourist.

[ChiFlyer]

7 minutes ago, penboy said:

The one year extension of stay is around the 12,500 mark.

Yes, you get the 90 day O in your home country. By getting it, there is less for the agent to do in getting the 1 year extension compared to VE or tourist.

My understanding is that the first one year extension of stay is a little more difficult. When one starts bargain hunting, one accepts the risk of interacting with less reputable agents. I used to do that. One of those agents is in the Monkey House and I lucked out with having no problems related to that. 

I will pay up a little for a more secure route on this item as it is important to me and also not an ongoing cost.

Also, I would like to get off of the cost discussion. A significant question that I was asking IMO, was applying for the 90 day O from somewhere other than my home country and what might be preferable countries to do that from nearer to Thailand. I have no interest in land entries. 

[davidge]

You don’t need to get a Non O, you can enter on a Tourist Visa or even on a Visa Exempt. 25k should be the rough cost for converting from a TR or Visa Exempt to a Non O plus the first Extension. It is far too much just to do the Extension (8k with cash in bank 12k without as a rough guide, without re entry permit). Either the agent is charging way too much or (more likely) misunderstood what you were asking.

A TR is easier to get than a Non O but with the e-visa system I’m not sure which countries in the region are now the best option. A friend is (finally) getting to Thailand to start his retirement and he’s going in Visa Exempt and has an agent lined up to get him the Non O plus first Extension. They said they need 15 days. 

[davidge]

Just pondering the e-visa system and it might be you’d have to put the USA as your location/permanent residence?? The system doesn’t seem to let you put a country where you don’t have some sort of legal long-term stay??

You need to upload proof of residence etc as part of the application. I’m assuming Embassies/Consulates in countries in the region will allow ‘walk in’ applications but I’m not certain as the online system was put in place during Covid so there really hasn’t  been much casual travelling.

You could well be able to actually apply from your condo in Jomtien by putting your USA details in. You’ll probably need a flight booking but could book a fully refundable one?

As I say, just pondering as all this is relatively new. 

[ChiFlyer]

11 minutes ago, davidge said:

You don’t need to get a Non O, you can enter on a Tourist Visa or even on a Visa Exempt. 25k should be the rough cost for converting from a TR or Visa Exempt to a Non O plus the first Extension. It is far too much just to do the Extension (8k with cash in bank 12k without as a rough guide, without re entry permit). Either the agent is charging way too much or (more likely) misunderstood what you were asking.

A TR is easier to get than a Non O but with the e-visa system I’m not sure which countries in the region are now the best option. A friend is (finally) getting to Thailand to start his retirement and he’s going in Visa Exempt and has an agent lined up to get him the Non O plus first Extension. They said they need 15 days. 

Thanks. With regard to over charging vs not understanding, probably some of both and I am cash in bank.

Sounds like the nearby countries approach will evolve as Covid restrictions (hopefully) continue to wind down. I would like to hear from anyone who has requested entry to Thailand from somewhere other than their home country.

I will consult with some friends in Phuket and report back what I find.

[ChiFlyer]

2 minutes ago, davidge said:

Just pondering the e-visa system and it might be you’d have to put the USA as your location/permanent residence?? The system doesn’t seem to let you put a country where you don’t have some sort of legal long-term stay??

You need to upload proof of residence etc as part of the application. I’m assuming Embassies/Consulates in countries in the region will allow ‘walk in’ applications but I’m not certain as the online system was put in place during Covid so there really hasn’t  been much casual travelling.

You could well be able to actually apply from your condo in Jomtien by putting your USA details in. You’ll probably need a flight booking but could book a fully refundable one?

As I say, just pondering as all this is relatively new. 

Thanks that helps. It would be great to apply from my condo before leaving. More to follow.

[ChiFlyer]

21 hours ago, davidge said:

Just pondering the e-visa system and it might be you’d have to put the USA as your location/permanent residence?? The system doesn’t seem to let you put a country where you don’t have some sort of legal long-term stay??

You need to upload proof of residence etc as part of the application. I’m assuming Embassies/Consulates in countries in the region will allow ‘walk in’ applications but I’m not certain as the online system was put in place during Covid so there really hasn’t  been much casual travelling.

You could well be able to actually apply from your condo in Jomtien by putting your USA details in. You’ll probably need a flight booking but could book a fully refundable one?

As I say, just pondering as all this is relatively new. 

e-visa sounds like the way to go. My legal residence is indeed in the US and depending on what they are asking for with regard to proof of residence, I can probably supply it. I will have to look into this. 

[davidge]

8 minutes ago, ChiFlyer said:

e-visa sounds like the way to go. My legal residence is indeed in the US and depending on what they are asking for with regard to proof of residence, I can probably supply it. I will have to look into this. 

As this is new, I’m not sure of all details but you might need to get timings right. The visa is obviously held on Immigration systems so you probably don’t want the new one issued before you leave the country? I’ve certainly read about people applying to their ‘home’ countries from a third country but not actually from within Thailand. 

I’m guessing it would show up when you left the country?  So get everything set, put in the application just before leaving then actually be given the visa when you’re in whatever country you decide to go to. Just take paperwork or scans on laptop in case they ask for more info. As I said, just pondering. 

[ChiFlyer]

52 minutes ago, davidge said:

As this is new, I’m not sure of all details but you might need to get timings right. The visa is obviously held on Immigration systems so you probably don’t want the new one issued before you leave the country? I’ve certainly read about people applying to their ‘home’ countries from a third country but not actually from within Thailand. 

I’m guessing it would show up when you left the country?  So get everything set, put in the application just before leaving then actually be given the visa when you’re in whatever country you decide to go to. Just take paperwork or scans on laptop in case they ask for more info. As I said, just pondering. 

Thanks again. I have moved the E-Visa portion of this discussion over to your E-Visa thread. Looks like there is lots of good info there. I have not read it all as of yet. Oh, and in case others want to browse that thread.

 

 

Edited May 4, 2022 by ChiFlyer

[kd_traveller]

Hi, I don't know if you have got this sorted yet, but I have just arrived in Thailand and could not get back before my previous "Retirement visa" expired so I have to start the whole process again.

I have arrived on "visa exempt" and I am being quoted 25K to convert to a Non O and then "Retirement visa", so 15 months for 25K and no need for any evisa.  It might be cheaper arriving on a Non O if it is possible, but the process of just coming on a visa exempt is just much simpler and no issues about where you are resident when applying for an evisa! 

[davidge]

5 minutes ago, kd_traveller said:

Hi, I don't know if you have got this sorted yet, but I have just arrived in Thailand and could not get back before my previous "Retirement visa" expired so I have to start the whole process again.

I have arrived on "visa exempt" and I am being quoted 25K to convert to a Non O and then "Retirement visa", so 15 months for 25K and no need for any evisa.  It might be cheaper arriving on a Non O if it is possible, but the process of just coming on a visa exempt is just much simpler and no issues about where you are resident when applying for an evisa! 

That’s what one of my friends is doing next month.

[kd_traveller]

Just now, davidge said:

That’s what one of my friends is doing next month.

The only complication that you mention in another thread is the return or onward ticket and I was asked about this when checking in.  Luckily I was prepared and had booked a €30 Phuket to Singapore flight which I showed them and this sorted this issue!  This was the cheapest flight I could find leaving Thailand internationally within the next month!!!

[ChiFlyer]

9 hours ago, kd_traveller said:

Hi, I don't know if you have got this sorted yet, but I have just arrived in Thailand and could not get back before my previous "Retirement visa" expired so I have to start the whole process again.

I have arrived on "visa exempt" and I am being quoted 25K to convert to a Non O and then "Retirement visa", so 15 months for 25K and no need for any evisa.  It might be cheaper arriving on a Non O if it is possible, but the process of just coming on a visa exempt is just much simpler and no issues about where you are resident when applying for an evisa! 

This is what I am planning to do. I have a lot of leeway with regard to the when. My current permission to stay runs to mid-October. I was thinking that I might be better off doing the process earlier, so that I could leverage the excessive Covid insurance that I had to buy last fall. 

I had not really thought about the onward ticket. Good point.

[ChiFlyer]

Ok - Step 1 of the conversion from OA to O is completed. This was a pretty simple step. I renewed my US passport so that I had more than one year remaining on it. I sent the package via DHL to the US Embassy in Bangkok, including a letter stating why I was renewing early. They want you to wait until you are under 6 months. They had a new passport back to me in about 3 weeks. Not Bad. I just dropped off the passports this morning in order to have the stamps moved over to the new passport at Thai Immigration.

My understanding is that I can not use the online 90 day app for my next 90 day date.

I have decided that Ho Chi Min City is my best choice for an exit and reenter location, due to the proximity, air fare costs, nice hotels (where I can use points), and current entry requirements for Americans. They have an e-visa system that looks easy to use. I figure to buy a one-way ticket to SGN and then a round trip back to BKK, throwing away the return to SGN portion. I will probably take the TGF with buying her a round trip BKK-SGN ticket. I should be careful with baggage charges.

I will most likely reenter Thailand on a 60 day tourist visa and then see an agent that I have been talking to in order to begin the Non-Im O process. Estimated cost for that is 25,000.

I am thinking that I can get away with a 10 day stay in SGN. I would submit the Thai e-visa process as soon as I get to SGN. I am thinking that I can fill out the Thai e-visa request before traveling to SGN, but not submit it until I am in SGN.

All of this is dependent that we are not all quarantining due to Monkey Pox. 😒

 

Edited May 25, 2022 by ChiFlyer

[davidge]

Picking up from the other thread (think this thread more appropriate).

Friend arrived yesterday using the Visa Exempt entry. He went to the agent today with his passport and up-to-date bank balance (he has the 800k in the bank).

Paid 25k for the conversion to a Non O and the first Extension of Stay (so 15 months in total). 90-day reports included but not Re-entry Permit - He paid 1000 baht for a Single, a Multiple would have been 4000.

Told to return in a couple of weeks or so.

 

[davidge]

To complete this, he got his passport back today with Non O Visa plus Extension of Stay so he’s good for 15 months.

It took 21 days start to finish.

[Bazle]

On 16/06/2022 at 15:01, davidge said:

Picking up from the other thread (think this thread more appropriate).

Friend arrived yesterday using the Visa Exempt entry. He went to the agent today with his passport and up-to-date bank balance (he has the 800k in the bank).

Paid 25k for the conversion to a Non O and the first Extension of Stay (so 15 months in total). 90-day reports included but not Re-entry Permit - He paid 1000 baht for a Single, a Multiple would have been 4000.

Told to return in a couple of weeks or so.

Wasn't he old enough for a Non-Imm O visa on the basis of retirement?

I arrived with one, and have just paid an agent 12K for a year's extension of stay, plus multiple re-entry - all done in less than 2 days.

 

[penboy]

29 minutes ago, Bazle said:

Wasn't he old enough for a Non-Imm O visa on the basis of retirement?

I arrived with one, and have just paid an agent 12K for a year's extension of stay, plus multiple re-entry - all done in less than 2 days.

 

I intend doing the same thing. Get a Non O immigrant in UK (£50?) it gives single entry for 90 days, then get an agent to do the rest. B12k is what I was quoted when in LOS 3 months ago. Couple of thousand baht for Bangkok bank account to be opened and deposit sorted.

Did you have difficulties doing the application in your own country? I have a current with more than £10k for 3 months and I will get insurance before I apply for visa.

[davidge]

52 minutes ago, Bazle said:

Wasn't he old enough for a Non-Imm O visa on the basis of retirement?

I arrived with one, and have just paid an agent 12K for a year's extension of stay, plus multiple re-entry - all done in less than 2 days.

 

I’ve explained a while ago in other threads, but he hasn’t been in the U.K. for about 20 years, apart from a visit of a few weeks last year, and it was difficult (maybe impossible) to get a Non O where he was. I was just showing it’s perfectly possible to enter on a Visa Exempt and get a Non O for Retirement once in Thailand.

I’m probably going to get a Non O from London before my November trip (though there’s a chance I’ll just decide to get a Tourist Visa - TR). I’ll decide in October.

[Bazle]

21 minutes ago, penboy said:

Did you have difficulties doing the application in your own country? I have a current with more than £10k for 3 months and I will get insurance before I apply for visa.

No problem. Just showed them my State Pension document.

[ChiFlyer]

Step 2 of the OA to O conversion started today. Basically I am doing a border run to Viet Nam to kill my Thai OA Visa status. I have decided to go to Da Nang instead of Saigon. Part of me feels that I should go to Saigon in order to see the place that was central to the War that so influenced my life, but I feel that Da Nang will give me a better feel for Vietnamese culture. Tips on places to see from that perspective would be appreciated. We (TGF is coming with) will only be there for 2 non-travel days. 

I applied for a one month entry visa to Viet Nam today. There are a lot of ads to get one to spend more money, but I believe this link is actually owned by Viet Nam immigration. BTW - Russians are granted visa upon arrival, but Americans are not. Oh yeah, the war thing.

https://vietnamvisa.govt.vn/

My visa request cost $51 USD. Good news is that I discovered that the TGF does not need a visa to enter Viet Nam. Some of the ads suggest that she does.

I am assuming that my Viet Nam visa request will be approved within 2 weeks. I booked a very nice hotel for our stay using Marriott points. Anyone know this hotel and/or the surrounding area.

https://www.marriott.com/en-us/hotels/dadsi-sheraton-grand-danang-resort/overview/

Looking at the airfares on Viet Nam Air, 2 round trip non-stop seats (Economy) will cost about $250 USD for the 1.5 hour flight. 

Step 3 of the conversion will be to reenter Thailand on the new 45 day visa on arrival, or whatever it is called now, and the see my agent to extend that to 90 days and a 1 year extension of stay. I am expecting those steps to cost about 25,000 THB.

 

Edited August 27, 2022 by ChiFlyer

[penboy]

1 hour ago, ChiFlyer said:

 

Step 3 of the conversion will be to reenter Thailand on the new 45 day visa on arrival, or whatever it is called now, and the see my agent to extend that to 90 days and a 1 year extension of stay. I am expecting those steps to cost about 25,000 THB.

 

Nope, it's visa exempt as it was previously. Only the duration has changed.