Bars/shops closed and for rent

[ichy2]

Hello folks:

Every morning I get out and walk five miles (about 8km) per day.  I've decided to take some photos on my morning constitutionals.  I will be posting pictures here to give the reader an idea of recognizable failed businesses , of which I assume will not be returning post pandemic.

Today I am documenting Walking Street as evidenced below:

 

 

[HimBadMan]

Nice topic.  Thanks for taking the time to take photos as you walk the city and notice for rent signs.

[lincsfun]

As the world is well aware of what is happening everywhere and how sad the situation is could you not try and take some pictures of things that might try and persuade us that there is some hope and light at the end of this tunnel.

Sure it will be harder to find than the gloom but im sure its out there somewhere.

However i do appreciate your efforts in trying and keeping us all informed  of current affairs in Pattaya and also helping this forum to have new content.

 

 

 

[ichy2]

Please read the topic heading.  If you object to my posts, you can certainly counter by booking a flight and spending 2 weeks and 30k baht for ASQ as I have to take your own photos.

But, to show that I am not a complete pessimist, attached is a business hanging on by a thread (and in support of that business, I did breakfast there):

 

[ichy2]

Soi 6 has only a few places that are now defunct:

 

[Edge]

 

Probably fair to say that most of the WS bars mentioned were predictably gone, as in they didn't reopen after the first lockdown.

I wasn't aware that Golden Club (formerly Sugar Baby) was one of them.
Along with Mandarin, I think they were bought by Chinese or Korean?

I suspect there are more eg. Mistys, Happy, LD Showcase, Annabel's etc etc but perhaps not all have For Sale/Rent signs up...........yet.

Perhaps @striderman  or @cartoonman could update us?

When last open, Pin-Up, Fahrenheit, Palace, Dollhouse, CEB (now upstairs DH) maybe Beavers, Windmill, Atlantis, CoCo? Tantra were still going but not many more?

[striderman]

13 minutes ago, Edge said:

 

Probably fair to say that most of the WS bars mentioned were predictably gone, as in they didn't reopen after the first lockdown.

I wasn't aware that Golden Club (formerly Sugar Baby) was one of them.
Along with Mandarin, I think they were bought by Chinese or Korean?

I suspect there are more eg. Mistys, Happy, LD Showcase, Annabel's etc etc but perhaps not all have For Sale/Rent signs up...........yet.

Perhaps @striderman  or @cartoonman could update us?

When last open, Pin-Up, Fahrenheit, Palace, Dollhouse, CEB (now upstairs DH) maybe Beavers, Windmill, Atlantis, CoCo? Tantra were still going but not many more?

i never wish distress on any bars (maybe excluding cap gate) but while i live here i don't know the owners. i do get info from other expats / assets  but i'm always reluctant to call time on any establishment unless i am absolutely certain. obviously right now everything is closed and what reopens is unknown especially as the current closure period is unknown, but probably lengthy

 

at some stage even if the landlord is giving a discount thre has to be a point where the keys get handed back

Edited July 24, 2021 by striderman

[Edge]

1 minute ago, striderman said:

i never wish distress on any bars (maybe excluding cap gate) but while i live here i don't know the owners. i do get info from other expats / assets  but i'm always reluctant to call time on any establishment unless i am absolutely certain. obviously right now everything is closed and what reopens is unknown especially as the current closure period is unknown, but probably lengthy

As a general rule, based on your experience, is it not fair to assume that if a For Sale/Rent sign is up then the previous operator is not intending to reopen?

[striderman]

Just now, Edge said:

As a general rule, based on your experience, is it not fair to assume that if a For Sale/Rent sign is up then the previous operator is not intending to reopen?

oh yeah but it's so depressing to take and post those photos. i have posted many in the bars opening and closing thread but it gives me no pleasure

[SirL]

27 minutes ago, Edge said:

Probably fair to say that most of the WS bars mentioned were predictably gone, as in they didn't reopen after the first lockdown.

Is there a category of gogos which haven't opened after the first lockdown, indeed haven't opened at all since about last March, which may well reopen, eg Sapphire, possibly KINK?

[Edge]

2 minutes ago, SirL said:

Is there a category of gogos which haven't opened after the first lockdown, indeed haven't opened at all since about last March, which may well reopen, eg Sapphire, possibly KINK?

I can say that Sapphire is one, the new owners having refurbished the bar and upper floors in anticipation.

Of the rest I expect such as What'sUp, Shark, Lighthouse, Sensations, Skyfall and others to open, but I have no 'inside' knowledge.

I know even less about LKM but the survival rate seemed much better there so probably the likes of KINK and Champagne will return.
The GoGos you're talking about probably have one thing in common, they are waiting for significant numbers of Western/farang punters to be landing at BKK before they think of re-opening - Catch 22 until/unless the vaccine situation is resolved.
Whether they can hold out that long depends how deep their pockets are and how reasonable their landlords are.

[Ohyesuare]

Pattaya Beer Garden is one that closed really early and didn't reopen after previous lockdowns, won't until/if tourists start returning in pre-covid numbers.

[SirL]

I've been taking as obvious that there was a group of gogo owners/managers who mothballed their bars back last April or so, who've been quietly keeping their powder dry/bank balances fairly intact, in order to be in some sort of shape to reopen whenever tourists started arriving again at BKK.  I've been assuming that because that's what I'd have done had I been owning a WS gogo thoughout all this.  Have I been too optimistic that such a group existed?

IMO it's been logical and bleedin' obvious, all the way from last March/April, that there would be at least a year before tourists returned in big numbers.  That's because from back then covid was obviously endemic forever within UK/EU, so it would have been certain that any 747 landing at BKK would contain several infections, and until Thailand had in place some sort of defence against those infections (ie mass vaccinations or a 100% isolated island), or willingness to go non-zero, that 747 couldn't be allowed to land with open 2019-style immigration, so there'd be negligible tourists until Thailand was ready to deal with incoming infections.  Many people have thought this viewpoint ridiculously doomandgloomy, I just thought it was obvious and logical.

Because it was obvious to me that there wouldn't be many tourists for well over a year, I've always admired what's been reported to be the approach of Sapphire's owner. 

Hmmm.  Is there an emoticon for 'at this point he loses quite a bit of the hope he had for the future of Pattaya'?

[Edge]

@SirL

I don't believe any of us anticipated a year ago where we would be today - by which I mean contemplating that it may well be mid 2022 before tourists even start to come in quarantine free.
That's at best and certainly not necessarily in numbers sufficient to justify re-opening mothballed GoGos.

For NWD Bryan posted that it had to be July 4-14..... that October was too long to wait - well October is approaching quite fast with little hope that Soi 6 will be open by then.

Of the 'group' of GoGos you consider to be keeping their powder dry, we have no idea how much powder they have or how long a wait they can survive, but my (pessimistic or realistic?) guess is that it's further away than most of them want to believe.

Case numbers are soaring, Delta has hold, vaccine supplies are unresolved.
How is it possible to be optimistic about how Pattaya's nightlife industry comes through this?

[fforest]

1 hour ago, Edge said:

As a general rule, based on your experience, is it not fair to assume that if a For Sale/Rent sign is up then the previous operator is not intending to reopen?

 

In my opinion and from what I have seen there are a few levels to being closed and out of business.....

 

#1....A business like Starbucks or Mcdonalds has been closed for a long time but inside nothing has changed and the sign is still up and they look in good shape...These kinds of places will almost for sure re-open.....

 

#2...The sign is still up but inside it looks like hell, with loads of bills taped to the door, like no one has been there for ages.....There seem to be lots Indian restaurants like this.....I would say 50/50 % chance they reopen.....

 

#3...A sign may or may not be up but a metal roll down is covering everything.... But its not for rent or sale.......These are wild cards......It's really hard to say......But I would lean on the side of not reopening....

 

#4....A for rent, for sale, for lease sign almost always mean the business is not reopening...

 

#5....Not only is there no business there but a door or a window or a wall is gone and it looks like the place has been pillaged....Not only have these places closed but they also look abandoned, with rats as the only customers........Unfortunately these places are growing in numbers all the time.....

[Realist]

3 hours ago, ichy2 said:

Please read the topic heading.  If you object to my posts, you can certainly counter by booking a flight and spending 2 weeks and 30k baht for ASQ as I have to take your own photos.

But, to show that I am not a complete pessimist, attached is a business hanging on by a thread (and in support of that business, I did breakfast there):

 

Jimmy, the great man who talked me into stopping off in Thailand, on my way to a 6 month trip around Australia in 1991, and I never looked back, I still call in when I pop  down, 2 or 3 times a year, to say hello to the family, and have a chat about the old days.

[SirL]

1 hour ago, Edge said:

@SirL

I don't believe any of us anticipated a year ago where we would be today - by which I mean contemplating that it may well be mid 2022 before tourists even start to come in quarantine free.

Yes, if mid-2022 before tourists even start is what we're now talking about, then yes very few did anticipate that, agreed. While I wouldn't disagree with that now, I didn't think that was now the general concensus.  Plenty of people seem to write as if they expect progress before then, but both you and I have long been pessimistic.

 

1 hour ago, Edge said:

That's at best and certainly not necessarily in numbers sufficient to justify re-opening mothballed GoGos.

Agreed.  

While it's easy to make good progress in the early part of getting a population vaccinated, when there are plenty of eager recipients, experience in Europe (young people lazy/uninterested/refusing) seems to suggest jabbing slows down after half/two thirds of the pop has been jabbed and it's slower to progress towards 100%, even when there's lots of vaccine available.  I think the moment of Thailand relaxing immigration because the pop is now sufficiently jabbed might be further away than is currently widely hoped.  Maybe later than mid-2022 for really open immigration.  Has Thailand realistically given up on the zero covid objective/policies yet?  Will Thailand insist on a zero covid target for its immigration policies, or will it relax Sandbox policies accepting the sort of ever-present covid eg the UK/EU seems to have accepted?

 

2 hours ago, fforest said:

there are a few levels to being closed and out of business.....

In terms of these five levels of closed-down-ness, could those in Pattaya now describe which of these levels the following businesses are now at, please?  How likely are those below to reopen?

1. Sapphire

2. Windmill

3. Annabels (or whatever the Windmill 2.0 opposite W was called)

4. Club Electric Blue (I mean the right hand one of it and Beavers, the one nearer Mistys)

5. Happy

6. Baccara

7. Fahrenheit

[Edge]

1 hour ago, SirL said:

........... could those in Pattaya now describe which of these levels the following businesses are now at, please?  How likely are those below to reopen?

1. Sapphire

2. Windmill

3. Annabels (or whatever the Windmill 2.0 opposite W was called)

4. Club Electric Blue (I mean the right hand one of it and Beavers, the one nearer Mistys)

5. Happy

6. Baccara

7. Fahrenheit

 

Sapphire, Fahrenheit and Windmill probably as sound as it's possible to be.......prob Baccara too.

CEB as described is gone....... to become a foyer for the hotel behind.

Happy would need a new owner.

Annabel's unclear .........David sub leased from Mr T then left the country.

[Soi7]

9 hours ago, Edge said:

As a general rule, based on your experience, is it not fair to assume that if a For Sale/Rent sign is up then the previous operator is not intending to reopen?

Any that are posting for rent/ for sale signs may well reopen but with new owners that think they have the magic touch and can make it work and maybe they can. But also we keep hearing no new licences for entertainment venues on Walking Street and i would assume they would need one to open their new club. But i wonder how many will not reopen despite not having a for rent or for sale I would guess many fall into that category as well. 

Walking Street used to be the one place mongers wanted/needed to visit for sure. I don't think that will be the case any longer time will tell question is just how much time will it talk my guess is Walking Street will begin to wake up middle of next year. If I am wrong (and that happens alot) it would be disaster. It's really just a waiting game..................

 

[SirL]

Larry, do you think there are many old or new gogo owners/managers, who haven't been operating in the last year or 15 months, quietly keeping out of the game now before (re)starting in the gogo business in several months time? Do you reckon there are many old or new guys patiently waiting now with cash, just waiting for the right moment to get active (again)?

Hope you're in good health and going well.

[SteveB]

12 hours ago, ichy2 said:

Soi 6 has only a few places that are now defunct:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Shame, that was always a busy bar Lisa Bar and would never closed.  Dam this virus that has had a huge effect on the world and people in it.  

Edited July 24, 2021 by SteveB

[Soi7]

4 hours ago, SirL said:

Larry, do you think there are many old or new gogo owners/managers, who haven't been operating in the last year or 15 months, quietly keeping out of the game now before (re)starting in the gogo business in several months time? Do you reckon there are many old or new guys patiently waiting now with cash, just waiting for the right moment to get active (again)?

Hope you're in good health and going well.

I would guess that yes there are a few guys just laying low till this blows over to get back into the game. It will bi interesting to see if licenses will be issued to guys wanting to take over a place that has closed. I really think that will be key. If they do not issue the needed licenses Walking street will not ever return to the way we knew it. So many places on both sides of WS are now looking for new owners or lease holders who knows maybe to be gift shops in the new Walking Street.

I am well thanks stay safe

[ichy2]

Today I walked the length of the beach from Soi 13 to the point at Dusit Thani.  On the way back I walked Soi 7 to 2nd Road.

The devistation of Soi 7 is nearly complete, at least the beer bar area west of Soi Night Out (the cross over from 8 to 7).  This is really sad for me as I spent a lot of time in this area on previous trips and met more than a few bar fines there.  Some of these places did not have for rent signs, but is obvious as to their current state.

 

Edited July 25, 2021 by ichy2
Spelling error corrections

[ichy2]

And while in the Soi 7 area, these are the spots on 2nd road up to Soi 8.

 

[fforest]

Yea for some reason 2nd road has been extra hard hit, from Pattaya Klang to Terminal 21 it's just unbelievable......Heck, I see it about once a week and I still can't believe it.......

That huge parking garage they are building at Terminal 21, I hope is a good omen for better times, because I can't see much of a need for it the way things are....