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KINGFISHER

Pensions into Thailand.

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KINGFISHER

This is slightly complicated, but here goes. Married to a Thai lady and at the moment living in the UK. Have two houses in Chiang Rai, one which we will eventually be our permanent home and a bungalow on the same estate which we rent to a Japanese guy and his Thai wife for 14,000 bt/month. The house we have in the UK is paid for as are the two houses in Chiang Rai. Now here's the possible problem! I receive a monthly pension of £1,000/ month, but when we sell our property in the UK we should get £130,000 to £140,000. The simple question is how do I stand?

Advice appreciated.

Cheers! KF.

 

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davidge

Sorry but I have no idea what you are asking.

How do you stand in what way?

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Kandinski

Its a "how long is string" question but guess as long as you have 800 K Thb on a bank account when its time to renew visa, health insurance and a few bahts left for rice you'll survive.

 

 

 

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jocky king

If I were you , I would keep the house in UK and rent that out cos in unforseeable future with your health and marriage. You will have a House in UK to fall back on . I don’t know what your rent is . Probably £600 a month . Would you be able to manage £1000 & £600 a month . Suppose your marriage fucked up , she have a greater chance to keep two houses in Chiang  Rai because of 51% of ownership in her name .  Will you go back to UK with nowhere to live . I have three condos in Pattaya but no wife , and a €250,000 home in Ireland . Will never sell my home in Ireland cos of unexpected circumstances in the future in Thailand  , possible Civil War , Health deteriorate, marriage break ups , Etc  . Just my two baht worth . 

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Scuba+

Reading between the lines you are asking "have i got enough money to live here"?

being married to a Thai, i think it's either 400k in the bank or 40k a month, I don't think you have enough money for 40k a month from abroad. So you'll need 400k in the bank. Can you do that?

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WalterA

Houses , in Thailand don’t count when they calculate..... only thing that counts is money in the bank in Thailand (not UK) and pension, it can be a combination of both .... 

money only

pension and money

 

Not married to a Thai you need 800,000 Baht yearly

Married to a Thai you need 400,000 Baht yearly 

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Ru4Real
10 hours ago, KINGFISHER said:

I receive a monthly pension of £1,000/ month, but when we sell our property in the UK we should get £130,000 to £140,000. The simple question is how do I stand?

I "think" this is the relevant part (given the thread title) i.e. how will selling the house affect his pension?

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ricktoronto

130000 doesn't generate much of an income if you want the capital to last. Maybe 5000 pounds a year if managed properly. So 17000 pounds a year with pension and 500 bucks rent a month.

Do the math on that. I couldn't live on it.

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mrfixer

You don't really give enough information...

is the £1k/month including state pension, or in addition to it?  Is it inflation-protected in any way?  Do you have additional cash savings/investments?

The houses I would assume belong to your wife. The ฿14k/month rental income is not really much and you have to factor in the cost of repairs etc - and houses in Thailand don't increase much in value (if at all) over time. 

If you rent out the UK house you may get, say, £600/month but again you would be responsible for repairs and may need to pay an agent to handle the rental. If you have problem tenants and/or void periods it could become a highly stressful situation for you.

The £1000 pension is ฿38000/month, which IMHO would be insufficient for two people to live comfortably if you factor in things like medical costs and occasional visits back to UK.

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KINGFISHER

By the time we go out to stay we would also have about an additional 30/40k pounds sterling.The £1k/month includes state pension. We would also be looking at starting some sort of a small business.

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Scuba+



We would also be looking at starting some sort of a small business.


Well....think very carefully about it, i.e. a business plan, not on the back of a fag packet like everyone else, otherwise your money will be gone

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taylor1975
2 hours ago, KINGFISHER said:

By the time we go out to stay we would also have about an additional 30/40k pounds sterling.The £1k/month includes state pension. We would also be looking at starting some sort of a small business.

So you will have some new capital, but don't know what to do with it?

Try and write a coherent answer, it does help. 

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semi-retired member

I think I'd wait a few months, to see what the Pound does after the end of this month, if I were the OP.

And while the Baht has been rising steadily over recent years, it's still a risk to have all your financial-eggs in the same Thai-basket.

What would you plan to do with the capital, if you did bring it in, buy a couple more properties to rent out, producing more income (taxable ?) here ? 

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bobSL1

You are in an excellent position. You own 3 properties with no mortgage, and a healthy income. It's yours to fuck up

I like others keep my uk property, not wise or healthy to have all your money assets here in Thailand. 

 

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mrfixer
20 hours ago, KINGFISHER said:

By the time we go out to stay we would also have about an additional 30/40k pounds sterling.The £1k/month includes state pension. We would also be looking at starting some sort of a small business.

I think you are in quite a difficult situation right now and I would delay any decision by at least six months until you see which way the GBP is going.

£1000 (of which I guess about £600 is state pension) is not much at all. The state pension amount will be frozen when you come to Thailand, and so you will experience a gradual fall in real income over time due to inflation. In ten years time your £1000 will be worth around £800 in today's money, due to inflation (assuming around 2% inflation).  Remember you will have to fund your healthcare and there are no health/disability benefits in Thailand. Healthcare costs seem to rise well ahead of inflation. You'll probably need to buy a car, and a new or newish one in good shape will cost at least £10k.

Obviously exchange rate fluctuations could have a big impact. Unlike some others I don't see any big jump ahead in the value of the GBP. 

My wife has a couple of houses in Thailand which she rents out, but makes relatively little profit from. Unlike the UK, houses in Thailand don't go up much in value (and often fall) and they seem to require quite frequent repair. Its the capital appreciation that makes letting out in the UK desirable, take that away and things don't look so favourable.

Starting a small business is very popular with Thai ladies - coffee shop, noodle shop, massage shop etc. Only a few make any money. My sister in law has tried about ten different businesses! Thailand is littered with the bones of failed small businesses so be very careful how much money you sink into it.

You are most likely to get reliable returns from renting out in the UK.  I would sell your current property and try to find a relatively new small house or apartment in an area that is popular with 'young professional' renters - somewhere in a town with hospital, university etc that provide steady employment. If the property is fairly new then it shouldn't need costly repairs for a while. Electric heating is no bad thing either since it is reliable and you won't get hit with the £2k gas boiler replacement after a few years.  It really helps if you have a trusted relative in the UK as a point of contact for the letting.

If things go pear-shaped for you in Thailand then you have somewhere to bail out to back in the UK.

I saw a post on another forum where a guy in his sixties had been living in Thailand for quite a few years on about £900/month. He'd been hit by a couple of very big medical bills that had wiped out most of his savings and was struggling to keep the family on his pension. He was heading back to the UK to look for work!  Certainly looking around Pattaya I notice a few familiar faces are no longer here, its just not cheap anymore.

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taylor1975
3 hours ago, mrfixer said:

I think you are in quite a difficult situation right now and I would delay any decision by at least six months until you see which way the GBP is going.

£1000 (of which I guess about £600 is state pension) is not much at all. The state pension amount will be frozen when you come to Thailand, and so you will experience a gradual fall in real income over time due to inflation. In ten years time your £1000 will be worth around £800 in today's money, due to inflation (assuming around 2% inflation).  Remember you will have to fund your healthcare and there are no health/disability benefits in Thailand. Healthcare costs seem to rise well ahead of inflation. You'll probably need to buy a car, and a new or newish one in good shape will cost at least £10k.

Obviously exchange rate fluctuations could have a big impact. Unlike some others I don't see any big jump ahead in the value of the GBP. 

My wife has a couple of houses in Thailand which she rents out, but makes relatively little profit from. Unlike the UK, houses in Thailand don't go up much in value (and often fall) and they seem to require quite frequent repair. Its the capital appreciation that makes letting out in the UK desirable, take that away and things don't look so favourable.

Starting a small business is very popular with Thai ladies - coffee shop, noodle shop, massage shop etc. Only a few make any money. My sister in law has tried about ten different businesses! Thailand is littered with the bones of failed small businesses so be very careful how much money you sink into it.

You are most likely to get reliable returns from renting out in the UK.  I would sell your current property and try to find a relatively new small house or apartment in an area that is popular with 'young professional' renters - somewhere in a town with hospital, university etc that provide steady employment. If the property is fairly new then it shouldn't need costly repairs for a while. Electric heating is no bad thing either since it is reliable and you won't get hit with the £2k gas boiler replacement after a few years.  It really helps if you have a trusted relative in the UK as a point of contact for the letting.

If things go pear-shaped for you in Thailand then you have somewhere to bail out to back in the UK.

I saw a post on another forum where a guy in his sixties had been living in Thailand for quite a few years on about £900/month. He'd been hit by a couple of very big medical bills that had wiped out most of his savings and was struggling to keep the family on his pension. He was heading back to the UK to look for work!  Certainly looking around Pattaya I notice a few familiar faces are no longer here, its just not cheap anymore.

The problem with your plan is you've just created taxable income, as personal allowance has already been used up. Says he gonna sell it anyway.

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semi-retired member

So perhaps invest the proceeds of the house-sale, if OP goes ahead with it, offshore instead of in the UK ?

But that's a fairly small sum, in offshore terms, I'm afraid.

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Jarrod2518
On ‎12‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 16:16, KINGFISHER said:

We would also be looking at starting some sort of a small business.

For the record - I am not a qualified financial advisor. I am a lawyer, however I am reasonable numerate(a B.Sc(Hons) & M.Sc in Maths and Statistics). Plus I have over 25 years of successful residential property investing in Australia & UK. In Thailand I have purchased two houses and a Condo.

From the information you have provided I consider that you need to be very cautious.

1 - you really need to appreciate and factor-in there are no certainties as to the longevity of relationships with Thai ladies, married or otherwise, particularly when they return to Thailand;

2 - selling your UK property is not a prudent course of action. In retirement you need to look at income not capital. Renting your house your in the UK as opposed to selling is a more prudent course of action both financially and managing other risks;

3 - selling your house to finance a small business start up in Thailand, not really a smart move;

4 - go for a Retirement Visa(RV) rather that a spouse visa(SP), the spouse visa is a nightmare;

5 -  the bank deposit for the RV, well once you are over here you will find that it is not a great an obstacle as it appears. Many Ex-Pats manage to sort it out with the help of agents.

6 - holding on to your house in UK you can use this as your residence for the State Age Pension. If you opt for a Thailand residency you will lose the annual increases. After a few years the real value of the pension will be eroded. may not look a big thing but after 10years of no increase????    

Other than that - go for it

  

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taylor1975
1 hour ago, semi-retired member said:

So perhaps invest the proceeds of the house-sale, if OP goes ahead with it, offshore instead of in the UK ?

But that's a fairly small sum, in offshore terms, I'm afraid.

Yes offshore is a decent option, if residency is lost. Suitable for income generation too.

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