BKK Cabbie Knifes American to Death ... Over THB 51 Dispute

[brutox]

... I've lived in BKK 13+ years ... I've experienced the Thai taxi drivers (and Thais in the resort markets, generally) growing increasingly aggressive to foreigners, and notably so in the last 2-4 years.

 

... I consider that Thais now clearly understand their homefield advantage, and see the coverage they often get from the notoriously and interminably corrupt Royal Thai Police, and Thais simply view this environment as an open hunting season on foreigners in Thailand ... honest to God, men, that's how I see it.

 

... wonder if the fault for this murder will be laid on the victim ... for allegedly having insulted a Thai's dignity ... not over the alleged THB 51 unpaid fare.

 

... with fucking cretinous animals as this driving about BKK, maybe we should all start carrying guns to defend ourselves ... would anyone trek into the lawless tribal African bush without a weapon? ... is a lawless Thailand really so very different? ... to whom do we turn when trouble hunts us down? ... a Royal Thai Police officer? ... pul-leaze!

 

... [please, anti-gun advocates, keep your bleating to yourselves ... you get my point ... foreigners are defenseless here.]

 

____________________________________________________________

 

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/358783/cabbie-charged-with-killing-american

 

Cabbie charged with killing American

 

Bangkok Post

 7 Jul 2013

 

Police have arrested a taxi driver who allegedly stabbed to death an American passenger on Sukhumvit Road, Bang Na on Saturday night

after an argument over the fare turned into a violent struggle.

 

 

Suspect Cherdchai Utamacha is taken to a press conference at Metropolitan Police Bureau on Sunday. (Photo by Thanarak Khoonton)

Police apprehended Cherdchai Utamacha, 32, at his apartment in Bangkok’s Prawes district early Sunday morning, Pol Col Tawatkiat Jindakuansanong, chief of Bangna police station, said.

 

Mr Cherdchai was accused of using a large knife to kill Troy Lee Pilkington, 50, after they had an argument that became a fight to the death near Sukhumvit Soi 68 in the Bang Na area at about 8.30pm on Saturday night.

 

Pilkington’s body was found in front of a tailor's shop, Miss Saturday, near the soi.

 

Pol Col Tawatkiat said Mr Cherdchai admitted killing the American.

 

The cab driver from Roi Et province told police he picked up Pilkington opposite Central Bangna department store to take him to his residence in Sukhumvit Soi 85.

 

When he reached the spot where the fatal attack took place, the road was jammed with traffic. Pilkington yelled at Mr Cherdchai and claimed he had cheated him on the fare. He got out of the car and walked away with the taxi meter showing 51 baht.

 

Mr Cherdchai opened the front passenger's window to ask for money from Pilkington but the passenger threw an empty coffee cup at him.

 

Angry at Pilkington’s departure and his refusal to pay the fare, Mr Cherdchai took an 18-cm-long machete from the taxi’s trunk. He claimed he only grabbed the weapon to threaten Pilkington but the passenger resisted him by running toward him in an effort to hurt him.

Mr Cherdchai claimed he panicked and slashed the man several times before they both wrestled for a short while. The cab driver said Pilkington fell to the ground but did not think he would die, and he fled the scene in his taxi.

 

After the attack, he dumped the machete into a canal in tambon Bang Pla of Bang Pli district in Samut Prakan province. He threw away his shirt at the mouth of Soi Kanchanaphisek 45 in Bangkok’s Prawes district.

 

Police have recovered both items from the two spots.

 

Pol Col Tawatkiat said the slain American had lived in Thailand for more than three years and could speak Thai fluently. He had a Thai girlfriend and lived with her in Soi Sukhumvit 85.

 

Mr Cherdchai has been charged with murder and carrying a weapon in public, the officer added.

[brewster]

Very sad.  No justification for it obviously, but very unwise to argue over something as insignificant as a cab fare.

 

RIP the victim.

[FROST MEDIC999]

Just as you have lived in Thailand and say you have seen the change in the Taxi Men and indeed Thais I have also seen the change in Tourists who know Fuck All think they will make a point with some pip squeak of a Thai and offend on a daily Basis both the Thai and Me

 

Tragic News but being realistic look for Stats on people stabbed in the UK this Weekend and I am sure not even 51 Baht would of been a reason..

 

Many many Thais are still good people from the taxi and Motorbike Mafia Mob to everybody else

 

Tragic that somebody has lost a Life but a little perspective sometimes is needed

 

RIP to the Yank and his Family

[brutox]

Very sad.  No justification for it obviously, but very unwise to argue over something as insignificant as a cab fare.

 

RIP the victim.

 .

... so ... we argue here over nothing that is insignificant for fear of being murdered ... we argue here over nothing that is significant for fear of being murdered ... are we to believe Thailand is a nation of psychotics, prepared to gut us open for having the temerity to merely look them directly in the eyes.

 

... in civilized cultures, two sober people arguing over a THB 51 cab fare seems a pretty safe bet not to end in murder ... if that happens in most civilized countries, we view the murderer as a sociopath.

 

... I'd say, you don't argue over the big stuff, not the little stuff ...  "Hey, you sleeping with my daughter?!" ... now, that is the sort of situation about which we would normally avoid confrontation ... but, a fucking THB 51 cab fare?!

 

... we'd all like to think that this Thai behavior is exceptional ... that the guy is a sociopath ... but ... in Thailand, it is not exceptional ... living here, farang residents see this sort of event far too often ... while most do not end a death, the degree of the mismatch between what is a reasonable response (by civilized standards), and what passes as perfectly expected Thai behavior is just sociological depravity.

 

... LOS! ... sure ... you bet ... what a stunning irony that is ...Thailand truely is an uncivilized culture ... think Sub-Saharan Africa uncivilized.

[brutox]

Many many Thais are still good people from the taxi and Motorbike Mafia Mob to everybody else

 

Tragic that somebody has lost a Life but a little perspective sometimes is needed

 .

... I know you've been here a goodly bit yourself Ghosty, but my experience has made me far more cynical than yours has made you.

 

... I guess it is the hipocracy of who I see Thais as, as opposed to how they see themselves ... a gentle nation of warm, smiling Buddhists who are prayerful. value life, eschew materialism and select the middle way to avoid confrontation.

 

... what total abject horseshit.

[FROST MEDIC999]

 .

... I know you've been here a goodly bit yourself Ghosty, but my experience has made me far more cynical than yours has made you.

 

... I guess it is the hipocracy of who I see Thais as, as opposed to how they see themselves ... a gentle nation of warm, smiling Buddhists who are prayerful. value life, eschew materialism and select the middle way to avoid confrontation.

 

... what total abject horseshit.

 

 

Matey you sound really Jaded by this and in fact Thailand.

 

Nothing will change, and if you are thinking it has got that Bad, maybe it is time to pack up and seek Pastures New .

 

I will still say, I think the Thais are very Tolerant of this new breed now coming Benidorm and Blackpool it isn't and the influx of many thinking it is the same are in for a rude awakening.

 

Some of the Ex Pats I know are very Bitter for various reasons and maybe it is easy to Blame the place or people when the Rose Tinted Specs come off.

 

Still a great place for me to be coming back regularly and I still feel safer than walking around many parts of the UK.

 

Anyway enough said by me I am over in 10 Weeks again maybe I should shout you a Beer in Nana

 

Ghosty

[bigbill340]

 

... I'd say, you don't argue over the big stuff, not the little stuff ...  "Hey, you sleeping with my daughter?!" ... now, that is the sort of situation about which we would normally avoid confrontation ... but, a fucking THB 51 cab fare?!

 

 

 

Mmmmmm....... not sure that that is right.

 

So you would start an argument over 51 Baht, but not over someone sleeping with your daughter? so to you an argument should only occur when it's outcome has little importance?

 

 

 

Bill

[moon71]

Whats been reported an what was the truth are two different things.

 

Taxi may have shown 51 baht but the yank may have verbally agreed to 200. Who knows.

 

The truth died when sadly someone lost there life, and now the taxi man will live with either a life changing fine or prison. Plenty of time for him to regret his actions.

 

This will not simply be brushed under the carpet this time. But justice itself may have to be paid off by the taxi man, and this won't be cheap.

[Taeng Mo]

I think I have, by virtue of my time in LOS, become more attuned to the way the Local Folks see us Farangs.

And that's not good, especially with the so-called "Rise of Asia".

Little do they know that it will take at least a Generation to filter down, if the Top Dogs let it.

Which has never been the case. Asia has always been known to stack the wealth at the top, unlike the West.

Which, I guess is why every Farker is trying to get to the West.

 

So, they run a serious risk of pissing off their established Tourist Market by telling them to Fark Off too early.

China is just not coming here, Korea is, by comparison, more suited to the Phlipps, India will always be India.

Driving the bargain (Sorry Chaps, but it's a good thing, because you are what divides the Farangs and the Japanese).

LOS needs to be careful. Too early for the Thai Lads to show how they really think.

 

Oh dear, I just read back and realised how off topic I was.

Many Apologies.

[jerry]

Getting killed for something as low as 51 Bht not even 2 Dollars ... swallow your pride pay the 50 bht

and walk away even if you know your being scammed . Not worth the possible trouble .

 

RIP .

[ICWATERS]

@ jerry

 

I Agree and you are correct , it is such a tragic thing  to think a life can be lost for less than two bucks no matter who is right

 

R I P The Victim

[sinbad5]

...

 

... wonder if the fault for this murder will be laid on the victim ... for allegedly having insulted a Thai's dignity ... not over the alleged THB 51 unpaid fare...

 

You need not wonder but only to look at the responses to this thread and another on the same incident to see that for a certain cohort no conduct by a Thai may ever be condemned. The Falang is always to blame.

[Davie Duke]

Ignore the smile. Look at the eyes.

[ctm]

Getting killed for something as low as 51 Bht not even 2 Dollars ... swallow your pride pay the 50 bht

and walk away even if you know your being scammed . Not worth the possible trouble .

 

RIP .

What about B500 or B5000 or B50000?  At what point is the low life scum farang allowed to have some human dignity and stand up for himself? 

[Chocolate thunder]

This is very sad Thais are generally good people withe the exception of a few god bless that mans family here in the states the situation could have been easily avoided that why you always think with a calm head about your situation. to lose your life and freedom over 51 baht is crazy

[Davie Duke]

This is from the news forum:

http://www.bestgore.com/murder/america-murder-taxi-driver-katana-bangkok-1-50-discrepancy/#

Credit to OP.

[ocean13]

had a few encounters with taxi drivers myself over the years and always in Bangkok, a regular LT seems to think its because most  farangs are seen as an easy target especially if drunk,     generally when the driver realises I am not drunk  or new to Thai  I see the head lower and a smirk of acceptence, always pay  the correct  money though.

[brutox]

had a few encounters with taxi drivers myself over the years and always in Bangkok, a regular LT seems to think its because most  farangs are seen as an easy target especially if drunk,     generally when the driver realises I am not drunk  or new to Thai  I see the head lower and a smirk of acceptence, always pay  the correct  money though.

.

... ocean13, I absolutely agree with your regular LT Thai girlfriend ... her view, that Thais see us as easy targets, is my "Open Hunting Season on Farangs" theory, about which I have blabbered elsewhere on the forum.

 

... farang, and especially the tourists, really are sitting ducks here ... members write above that farang should never argue with a Thai over even the smallest of disputes ... if Thais believe that is our likely response, there is no end to the lying, cheating and thieving ... open hunting season on farangs.

 

... except for farang who have created their informal Thai backup here, farang have no recourse to the interminably corrupt Royal Thai Police ... knowing that, criminal Thais can fire at will, knowing they are unlikely to be apprehended, and if apprehended, they can reasonably/easily avoid prosecution by availing themselves of the common corrupt practices ... again ... open hunting season on farangs.

 

... I've watched this gradual transition over the last half dozen years, or so ... that criminal Thais (and the corrupt Royal Thai Police with whom they partner) come after us in unsurprising ... they have always done that ... but ... what is so deeply disconcerting is that assaults on farang are now perpetrated by Thais in the open and without restrictions.

 

... corrupt and criminal Thais have grown fearless of reprisal, legal or otherwise (for the overwhelmingly majority,we are unarmed) ... now, I enjoy Thailand officialdom's laizze-faire attitude on moral lifestyle issues as much as the next man ... but ... unrestricted attacks of farang as targets for out-and-out robbery, extortion, etc. ain't good for anyone.

 

... think of the depths of destruction to which former holiday hotspots such as Jamaica and many parts of Mexico have sunk ... plenty of cheap carnal pursuits there, but does anyone go there anymore, much less live there?

.

[brewster]

 .

... so ... we argue here over nothing that is insignificant for fear of being murdered ... we argue here over nothing that is significant for fear of being murdered ... are we to believe Thailand is a nation of psychotics, prepared to gut us open for having the temerity to merely look them directly in the eyes.

 

... in civilized cultures, two sober people arguing over a THB 51 cab fare seems a pretty safe bet not to end in murder ... if that happens in most civilized countries, we view the murderer as a sociopath.

 

... I'd say, you don't argue over the big stuff, not the little stuff ...  "Hey, you sleeping with my daughter?!" ... now, that is the sort of situation about which we would normally avoid confrontation ... but, a fucking THB 51 cab fare?!

 

... we'd all like to think that this Thai behavior is exceptional ... that the guy is a sociopath ... but ... in Thailand, it is not exceptional ... living here, farang residents see this sort of event far too often ... while most do not end a death, the degree of the mismatch between what is a reasonable response (by civilized standards), and what passes as perfectly expected Thai behavior is just sociological depravity.

 

... LOS! ... sure ... you bet ... what a stunning irony that is ...Thailand truely is an uncivilized culture ... think Sub-Saharan Africa uncivilized.

 

Well I live here and I certainly don't often see confrontations between Thais and farangs, nor do I consider Thailand or Thais to be uncivilised.  I guess we just mix in different circles.

[Davie Duke]

.

... ocean13, I absolutely agree with your regular LT Thai girlfriend ... her view, that Thais see us as easy targets, is my "Open Hunting Season on Farangs" theory, about which I have blabbered elsewhere on the forum.

 

... farang, and especially the tourists, really are sitting ducks here ... members write above that farang should never argue with a Thai over even the smallest of disputes ... if Thais believe that is our likely response, there is no end to the lying, cheating and thieving ... open hunting season on farangs.

 

... except for farang who have created their informal Thai backup here, farang have no recourse to the interminably corrupt Royal Thai Police ... knowing that, criminal Thais can fire at will, knowing they are unlikely to be apprehended, and if apprehended, they can reasonably/easily avoid prosecution by availing themselves of the common corrupt practices ... again ... open hunting season on farangs.

 

... I've watched this gradual transition over the last half dozen years, or so ... that criminal Thais (and the corrupt Royal Thai Police with whom they partner) come after us in unsurprising ... they have always done that ... but ... what is so deeply disconcerting is that assaults on farang are now perpetrated by Thais in the open and without restrictions.

 

... corrupt and criminal Thais have grown fearless of reprisal, legal or otherwise (for the overwhelmingly majority,we are unarmed) ... now, I enjoy Thailand officialdom's laizze-faire attitude on moral lifestyle issues as much as the next man ... but ... unrestricted attacks of farang as targets for out-and-out robbery, extortion, etc. ain't good for anyone.

 

... think of the depths of destruction to which former holiday hotspots such as Jamaica and many parts of Mexico have sunk ... plenty of cheap carnal pursuits there, but does anyone go there anymore, much less live there?

.

Good point.

[giel]

In my six years living in Bkk I've seen a lot of misbehaving taxi drivers and a lot of misbehaving falangs as well.

I think the 51 Baht is bullshit and first he said coffee was thrown in his face and later a cup which is not impossible but highly unlikely (think of it, a man getting into a taxi with a cup of coffee?) Specially the Sukhumvit/ soi Nana taxi mafia would not pick me up to Watcharapon for under 500 Baht unless my Thai wife is with me and all my friends got the same experience. They would not activate the meter for a falang and if you ask they would quote some stupid fare and if you only notice after you left your pick-up point they will say they forgot and you still have to pay the stupid amount.

Then the best best part: he wanted to threaten the old falang with the machette but then the old falang (unarmed) attacked the young and armed man! 

Depending on where you find yourself, I've noticed a lot of antagonism from Thais which might be justified in some cases but stowing a machette (the police called it a knife!) and then using it sounds psychopathic 

[Skalliwag]

What about B500 or B5000 or B50000?  At what point is the low life scum farang allowed to have some human dignity and stand up for himself?

 

When he is absolutely positive the other guy doesn't have a big sharp knife.Or a gun,or ten friends.

[greenlite]

it's hard to buy the taxi drivers version. many times I have taken a taxi and when you get there they ask for more than the agreed price.so the farang is going to argue over 51 baht and throw a coffee in the drivers face and think he is just going to drive off? how many taxis are offering to take fares for under 100baht? the story doesn't add up.

[BahnKhamin]

 ... in civilized cultures, two sober people arguing over a THB 51 cab fare seems a pretty safe bet not to end in murder .

 

I can think of a lot of places in the USA where someone will most likely kill you for less than this. NYC, East LA, Little Rock................

[cisco999]

 .

... so ... we argue here over nothing that is insignificant for fear of being murdered ... we argue here over nothing that is significant for fear of being murdered ... are we to believe Thailand is a nation of psychotics, prepared to gut us open for having the temerity to merely look them directly in the eyes.

 

... in civilized cultures, two sober people arguing over a THB 51 cab fare seems a pretty safe bet not to end in murder ... if that happens in most civilized countries, we view the murderer as a sociopath.

 

... I'd say, you don't argue over the big stuff, not the little stuff ...  "Hey, you sleeping with my daughter?!" ... now, that is the sort of situation about which we would normally avoid confrontation ... but, a fucking THB 51 cab fare?!

 

... we'd all like to think that this Thai behavior is exceptional ... that the guy is a sociopath ... but ... in Thailand, it is not exceptional ... living here, farang residents see this sort of event far too often ... while most do not end a death, the degree of the mismatch between what is a reasonable response (by civilized standards), and what passes as perfectly expected Thai behavior is just sociological depravity.

 

... LOS! ... sure ... you bet ... what a stunning irony that is ...Thailand truely is an uncivilized culture ... think Sub-Saharan Africa uncivilized.

.

 

 

 

Sadly things get out of hand  in LOS and I wouldn't expect a Thai to become a good negoiator.

 

 

Yank or Swiss or Aussie or whatever it is not OK.