What's the point in getting a visa?

[bnjmnkrs]

Can somebody tell me why, if you plan on staying a year or more, you should even bother getting a visa? Don't get me wrong, the current visa I have is legit, but if one can simply show up at Suvarnabhumi with 20,000 baht to pay the fine and have the whole process completed in five minutes, why go through the trouble of making numerous trips to Laos/Combodia etc. which add up to just as much (if not more) anyway?

[Mr David]

I don't know as I'm just a tourist but would hazard a guess it will cost you far more if you get stopped before you make it to the airport.

[tode1640]

I may be wrong, but if you overstay and pay the fine do you not risk getting banned from entry in the future? Many countries don't look kindly upon people who overstay their visas. Also, if you are put on a blacklist, you wouldn't necessarily know until you turned up at immigration. This would not be good!

[bnjmnkrs]

I may be wrong, but if you overstay and pay the fine do you not risk getting banned from entry in the future?

 

Nope, apparently it's possible to pay the fine, exit, and come right back in.

[bnjmnkrs]

I don't know as I'm just a tourist but would hazard a guess it will cost you far more if you get stopped before you make it to the airport.

 

20,000 is the maximum fine. Of course, you'd spend a few days in detention at immigration if you got caught, but in that case from what I understand your fine would actually be lower, way, way lower than 20,000 - if go in front of a judge. Besides, I've personally never had to show my visa, even if - as is the case, you are required to carry your passport on you at all tiems - just make a photocopy of your front page, and you won't have to show your actual passport with the visa.

[tode1640]

Nope, apparently it's possible to pay the fine, exit, and come right back in.

 

Even if that is the case, I'm not sure if I would trust this. In many countries immigration policies do tend to change frequently - often with no notice. Also, as others have pointed out, before you got to the airport you would be an illegal immigrant. If you got arrested for something else (such as a trivial traffic offence), you could suddenly find yourself thrown in jail, until you get a court hearing, and then deported. I am pretty sure that if you are deported as an illegal immigrant then you wouldn't be able to get back in.

 

It all sounds like a pretty high, and unnecessary risk to me.

[stud muffin1234]

Whats the point of Visa's.......mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

the Law...???

 

but then hey depends what side of the RADAR you live under.....

[bnjmnkrs]

Even if that is the case, I'm not sure if I would trust this. In many countries immigration policies do tend to change frequently - often with no notice. Also, as others have pointed out, before you got to the airport you would be an illegal immigrant. If you got arrested for something else (such as a trivial traffic offence), you could suddenly find yourself thrown in jail, until you get a court hearing, and then deported. I am pretty sure that if you are deported as an illegal immigrant then you wouldn't be able to get back in.

 

It all sounds like a pretty high, and unnecessary risk to me.

 

Well yes, of course it stands to reason one must stay out of trouble - but even if one didn't, police in Thailand aren't the most...upstanding of characters - a simple on the spot fine should take care of any minor offences caused. Of course it's a risk, but then so is sleeping with prostitutes, from a personal as well as legal viewpoint - considering that it's technically illegal.

 

Whats the point of Visa's.......mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

the Law...???

 

With all due respect, who gives a shit about 'the law'? Especially when it involves something like a little fucking stamp and involves a victimless 'crime'?

Edited April 13, 2012 by bnjmnkrs

[stud muffin1234]

 

With all due respect, who gives a shit about 'the law'? Especially when it involves something like a little fucking stamp and involves a victimless 'crime'?

 

 

Duh then why ask the Question Einstien...!!!!!!

[bnjmnkrs]

 

 

Duh then why ask the Question Einstien...!!!!!!

 

To identify whether or not there is some significant, tangible downside/risk, and compare that risk, whatever it may be, with the hassle of numerous border trips, etc.

[Noud]

So lets get this right you are asking if it is reasonably safe and cheap to commit a crime, compared to doing it the proper way.

 

I'd do it the legal way myself. As someone said, these things can change quick, and without notice.

 

While this might not be something that as seen a big problem today, it is something that could backfire later on, I wouldn't like to set myself for that.

[FROST MEDIC999]

Mate my Two Pence worth

 

If you overstay you run the risk of that Stamp in your passport, and your details logged into the main frame of the Computer. You also will possibly spend a few days in the Monkey House or Police holding Cells and have to cough up many Baht.

 

If you then decide you want ot then come back it is quite possible to be refused entry on arrival and further return visits put into doubt. Do you want to chance that ?

 

Me I would go down the correct pathway.

 

In answer to your question about why ? Its the Law Simple

 

Cheers

[bnjmnkrs]

So lets get this right you are asking if it is reasonably safe and cheap to commit a crime, compared to doing it the proper way.

 

No mention about it being cheap, as it's about the same as doing visa trips, nor am I asking if it's safe, I'm only suggesting that it seems like a superior or at least equal alternative to doing repeat visa runs.

 

If you then decide you want ot then come back it is quite possible to be refused entry on arrival and further return visits put into doubt.

 

Only if you get caught. If you fly out and pay your fine at the airport (see below) there is absolutely no issue. So just stay out of trouble with the police and you should be fine, if you can't even do that, you'll probably ending spending a few days in detention anyway for whatever other crimes the police catch you for.

 

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/404494-report-your-overstay-experience-here/

http://www.thaipulse.com/blog/living-in-thailand/experiences/overstaying-your-thailan-visa-by-years/

[SLEUTH]

 

To identify whether or not there is some significant, tangible downside/risk, and compare that risk, whatever it may be, with the hassle of numerous border trips, etc.

 

If your going to spend a year in a country it would be nice to embrace a bit of culture a good start would be staying on the right side of the law.

 

Thailand is bordered by several countries worth visiting a triple entry visa extended each time and a visit to Cambodia/Laos/Malaysia and you would be just about there?

 

The hassle is not looking over your shoulder,the downside as already said is prison. If you wish to do it your way carry on and best of luck.

 

+66(0)2-263 72 00 Just in case

[FROST MEDIC999]

 

No mention about it being cheap, as it's about the same as doing visa trips, nor am I asking if it's safe, I'm only suggesting that it seems like a superior or at least equal alternative to doing repeat visa runs.

 

 

 

Only if you get caught. If you fly out and pay your fine at the airport (see below) there is absolutely no issue. So just stay out of trouble with the police and you should be fine, if you can't even do that, you'll probably ending spending a few days in detention anyway for whatever other crimes the police catch you for.

 

http://www.thaivisa....xperience-here/

http://www.thaipulse...-visa-by-years/

 

Matey I am a little worried about you asking for advice, then seemingly to ignore what appears to be an agreed collective posting by Members.

 

The bottom line is risk it if you want, none of us care if you do or not and Two cases below which were dealt in Two different manners show what may or may not occur

 

Do you want to be like this in a Monkey House ?

 

 

Consequences of a Having an Overstay in Thailand For Long Overstays - With a longer overstay, things are a lot different. If you can get a flight and leave, at the airport you will likely be fined 20,000 baht, regardless of whether your overstay was six weeks, six months or six years. You will get a stamp in your passport saying you overstayed and then, most likely, be allowed to leave. However.....depending on the mood of the immigration officer, you could be arrested and held in the immigration holding area, and then transported to a Thai jail to await trial. Again, do you really want to take that chance?

I met two people who have been on overstays for years. One recently left Thailand via Suvarnabhumi Airport, where he paid the 20,000 baht fine, had his passport stamped with an overstay and left. He came back to Thailand three weeks later on a valid tourist visa, and had no problems re-entering the country. He's now living on a legal visa and work permit, so his troubles are over.

The other guy has been illegally living in Thailand for five years. I recently found out he had been arrested, thrown in a Thai jail and was serving a six month sentence. Once he has finished serving his sentence, he will be deported from Thailand and will probably not be allowed back in the country for a certain period of time. Again, why chance it?

To have an overstay in Thailand of a few days isn't too serious. We all make mistakes and bad things sometimes happen. However, if you have an overstay of several weeks, months or years, it's an entirely different story. Bad things can happen.....to you. And, if they do, you'll only have yourself to blame. Don't stay in Thailand on overstay visas deliberately. It's really not worth it.

 

Cheers

[ExpatDave]

Whats the point of Visa's.......mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

 

the Law...???

 

but then hey depends what side of the RADAR you live under.....

 

 

[bnjmnkrs]

If your going to spend a year in a country it would be nice to embrace a bit of culture a good start would be staying on the right side of the law.

 

Thailand is bordered by several countries worth visiting a triple entry visa extended each time and a visit to Cambodia/Laos/Malaysia and you would be just about there?

 

The hassle is not looking over your shoulder,the downside as already said is prison. If you wish to do it your way carry on and best of luck.

 

+66(0)2-263 72 00 Just in case

 

As already noted I'm on a valid visa already, (although it is expiring soon) - and this won't be my first year in Thailand. But thanks for the number , cheers.

[stud muffin1234]

Dah Gangster is in the house ghosty....LOL

[bnjmnkrs]

Matey I am a little worried about you asking for advice, then seemingly to ignore what appears to be an agreed collective posting by Members.

 

Thanks for your concern, but I'm not asking for advice - if I ever do decide to go this route it will be the result of my decision making alone. I'm already aware that there are those who frown down on the practice, and I didn't need to make a thread to find that out. But again, thanks.

[Noud]

 

No mention about it being cheap, as it's about the same as doing visa trips, nor am I asking if it's safe, I'm only suggesting that it seems like a superior or at least equal alternative to doing repeat visa runs.

 

Quoted from from your first post "why go through the trouble of making numerous trips to Laos/Combodia etc. which add up to just as much (if not more) anyway?"

 

And further down "To identify whether or not there is some significant, tangible downside/risk, and compare that risk, whatever it may be, with the hassle of numerous border trips, etc. "

 

Ok so you are not asking if it is cheaper or safe to do, then what are you asking? More convenient? well duh.

 

 

Only if you get caught. If you fly out and pay your fine at the airport (see below) there is absolutely no issue. So just stay out of trouble with the police and you should be fine, if you can't even do that, you'll probably ending spending a few days in detention anyway for whatever other crimes the police catch you for.

http://www.thaivisa....xperience-here/

http://www.thaipulse...-visa-by-years/

 

You don't always have to do something wrong to get some attention, if that is a risk you are willing to take is up to you.

So far they seem to have been pretty lenient with this, if they will change is hard to tell but during the last years the rules have changed. Border runs by land used to give 30 days but are down to 15 right? Who says there will not be other changes comming?

[bnjmnkrs]

Ok so you are not asking if it is cheaper or safe to do, then what are you asking?

 

I'm asking: why not? Is there any significant downside? And if there is is, do the downsides outweigh the benefits?

 

And so far I've got a few answers, the main problem seems to be the rules changing all of a sudden, and getting arrested - and of course that's a fair concern, but it seems like it's a reasonable risk to take in order to avoid the extreme hassle of numerous border trips/overnight stays in Laos. Besides, if you plan on staying longer than 1 year (say, 5) the savings would amount to nearly 100,000 Baht, possibly more. That's a pretty significant upside, assuming you're not dumb enough to get arrested - hell, even if a rule change were to come into effect, there would probably be some warning/a grace period during which you could exit and re-enter.

[stud muffin1234]

I'm asking: why not? Is there any significant downside? And if there is is, do the downsides outweigh the benefits?

 

And so far I've got a few answers, the main problem seems to be the rules changing all of a sudden, and getting arrested -

 

yea have you not answered your own question.......

 

 

downside.... prison, fine, refusal entry next trip.....

 

saving 100000 baht.... its £2000 for frick sake not MILLIONS

[Noud]

there would probably be some warning/a grace period during which you could exit and re-enter.

 

Possibly, but the main problem now is that might not be following the rules just letting you out with a fine as it is. What the actual law say i don't know, but if you get trouble now seems more up to the cop/officer than the actual law. If changes where made there is no telling how things would be. After all it's Thailand.

 

To even out the equation a bit more, what would the cost be if you were deported? apart from possibly not being able to come back. Expensive tickets? Unsure where to go once home? and so on.

 

As I don't know your full situation, I can't give any good advice as to what visa to use, but as I'm sure you know there are a few different types, surely one got work for you?

[bnjmnkrs]

To even out the equation a bit more, what would the cost be if you were deported?

 

Well for starters, less than 20,000 baht - if you go before a judge and get deported it seems the fine is usually 7-8000 max.

 

As I don't know your full situation, I can't give any good advice as to what visa to use, but as I'm sure you know there are a few different types, surely one got work for you?

 

Yes of course, the problem isn't getting a visa - I just don't really see the point of going through the trouble. From my perspective, if one does a cost-benefit analysis it comes out in favor of overstaying. Of course, other people obviously come to a different conclusion. I guess it depends on how you assess the costs, some really don't want to do something 'illegal' (but then sleep with prostitutes, go figure), some are afraid of the rules changing on them, others are worried about being arrested - but from my perspective the benefits of not having to make visa trips outweighs what I consider to be a very small risk of things going wrong. Just my two cents.

[tode1640]

some really don't want to do something 'illegal' (but then sleep with prostitutes, go figure)

 

Sorry to be pedantic, but this is a common fallacy. It is not illegal to sleep with prostitutes in Thailand. In fact, prostitution isn't (any more) illegal per se - rather it is illegal if it is done in a promiscuous manner. The law doesn't define promiscuous, and it is at the discretion of the police as to what they call promiscuous (which is, of course, a great recipe for corruption). However, it is certainly not illegal to be a customer of a prostitute.